MONDAY, AUGUST 14, 2023
[Us and Them] the people: We wish we could escape the feeling that Trump is going to win.
Importantly, let's be fair! For tens of millions of fellow citizens, it's a consummation devoutly to be wished that Donald J. Trump should make his way into the White House again.
We disagree with those neighbors and friends concerning this question—but then, they disagree with us! For ourselves, no devout wish allows us to shake the somewhat improbable thought that Trump will end up in the Oval again.
Why are we wracked with this strange suspicion? It's the cluelessness of our own blue tribe which has us so persuaded—which murders sleep in this way.
We blues can spot the cluelessness of the reds—and the cluelessness of the current red tribe seems to know few bounds. That said, we blues are deeply clueless too, in ways which make us vulnerable.
That brings us to the statement we saw Steve Cohen make on yesterday's Washington Journal.
We refer to Rep. Steve Cohen, the Memphis Democrat. The leading authority on Cohen's career thumbnails him as shown:
Stephen Ira Cohen (born May 24, 1949) is an American attorney and politician serving as the U.S. representative from Tennessee's 9th congressional district since 2007. He is a member of the Democratic Party. The district includes the western three-fourths of Memphis. Cohen is Tennessee's first Jewish congressman and since 2023 has been the only Democrat in the state's congressional delegation.
[...]
Cohen is easily the most progressive member of the Tennessee delegation, and arguably one of the most progressive congressmen ever to represent the state. He has a lifetime rating of 4.3 from the American Conservative Union; for most of his tenure he has had the lowest ACU rating of any lawmaker from Tennessee.
He is the first Jew to represent Tennessee in Congress, the first white Democrat to represent a significant portion of Memphis since freshman George W. Grider was defeated by Republican Dan Kuykendall in 1966, the first Jew to represent a majority black district, and one of the few white congressmen to have represented a black-majority district.
Rep. Cohen has been elected to the House, then re-elected, a total of nine times. He's deeply invested in modern-day liberal / progressive politics.
Also, he made the recent statement in question—a statement which made us think, all over again, that Trump may again get elected.
Rep. Cohen made the statement in question on a recent MSNBC program. C-Span aired tape of his statement near the start of yesterday's 7 A.M. hour.
At issue was the following question: Should Trump's future federal trial be televised? Specifically, C-Span's question was this:
TELEVISE FMR. PRESIDENT TRUMP'S 2020 ELECTION INTERFERENCE TRIAL?
On MSNBC, Cohen had said that the trial should be televised. He had voiced this view as part of a lengthier statement concerning our need for "the truth."
In one major way, Rep. Cohen's statement was 100 percent spot on. In another way, it seemed to us that his statement was remarkably unsophisticated—all in all, was remarkably clueless.
Yesterday, C-Span aired the videotape of Rep. Cohen's statement. (Click here, go three minutes in.) It made us think that our pro-Trump fellow citizens may have some happy days ahead:
COHEN (8/5/23): We have seen our nation become more divided than any time, I guess, since the Civil War. It's totally divided, but it's divided now not on whether you are in favor of slavery or against slavery, it's whether or not you see facts and admit that they're the truth or not.
We have a problem just in seeing reality and the facts and working off the same song sheet.
We are siloed by cable television. If you watch MSNBC and CNN, you see a certain version of the news, which I think is the truth. And if you watch Fox or Newsmax or some of those stations, you see fiction, and that is why they had multi hundreds of millions of dollar judgments against them for lying about Dominion Voting and other things on Fox, and they're going to have others.
But we need to make sure that the people can watch this, and see it on their own, and not have to watch it through the eyes and ears of Fox and Newsmax, who would take Trump's position and tilt and switch the perspectives to be what Trump wants. And not the truth.
The truth needs to be seen, because otherwise they don't accept the judgment, and I'm just assuming—you know, he is presumed innocent, but I think he is guilty as Al Capone, as anybody can be. If they do not see the trial, they might not accept it, because on Fox they will show this as being something like Florence Nightingale.
We need "the truth," the solon kept saying. As he did, we groaned.
Briefly, let's be fair:
We are siloed by cable television, Rep. Cohen said. In our view, that statement is totally accurate. His statements about the way "the news" is delivered on Fox also struck us as largely, though not wholly, accurate.
After that, the deluge! Rep. Cohen's statements about "the truth," and about where it's found, struck us as hopelessly clueless.
"What is truth?" Pontius Pilate is famously said to have said. From that day to this, opinions have differed as to what he may have meant by his query, if he actually made it.
That said, what is truth? With our logicians locked away in their ivory towers on their leafy college campuses, there's no one to help us see how knotty a question that is.
All through yesterday's 7 A.M. hour, various callers, from each of our tribes, insisted that we need to find a way for "the truth" to emerge, apparently in a way we all can agree on.
These callers didn't seem to understand why that will never happen in the matter under review. Whether from the red tribe or the blue, these C-Span viewers were every bit as uncomprehending as Rep. Cohen had been.
"The American people are pretty sharp?" Actually, no—we aren't! We thought Rep. Cohen was spectacularly clueless in one major part of his statement—and it made us fear, once again, that Trump will return to the White House.
Yesterday morning, on Washington Journal, Us and Them the American people kept calling C-Span, saying we need "the truth." Our public discourse is very primitive—and that's just among us blues!
Tomorrow: Callers requesting "the truth"
"For ourselves, no devout wish allows us to shake the somewhat improbable thought that Trump will end up in the Oval again."
ReplyDeleteThis should be discussed with a therapist. Unsupported fears of doom and gloom are a psychiatric symptom. Or it may be an extension of this:
https://jabberwocking.com/even-a-home-security-guy-thinks-weve-gone-cuckoo-over-security/
Conservatives win votes by playing on the fears of voters. Somerby acknowledges consuming right wing sources of info. This may be the inevitable result -- freefloating anxiety that attaches itself to whatever one encounters without reason. Trump is about to be indicted yet again. He has already been convicted of defamation and sexual abuse. There are not enough Republicans to reelect him.
Somerby needs to examine his fears, confront them, cut them down to size and then set them aside. Otherwise he will ruin for himself the days he has left on this planet. And it isn't good for our society when anxious people spread their irrational fears to others. Doing nothing about fear allows it to grow disproportionately and immobilize one in daily life.
How can we combat fears of Trump being reelected? One way is to actively work to defeat whatever Republican is nominated, to support Biden (or which Democrat is nominated) and to help get out the vote in 2024. Doing something constructive is an antidote to fear, especially when it arises from passivity and a sense that one cannot control one's destiny against feared outcomes. Perhaps Somerby thinks he is doing something constructive here with this whining about Trump and chiding liberals, but that isn't going to prevent Trump from winning again, whereas supporting those running against Trump might help. But it depends on whether Somerby wants to pretend to be a victim or actually do something useful to keep Trump out of office again. Promoting a sense of victimization is another symptom of too much Fox News and not enough thinking.
Well said, thank you.
DeleteSomerby wants Truth to be examined by logicians when it is simply a matter of one side lies and the other side doesn't. Trump and his supporters are still lying, as they have done since day one when Trump first came down the escalator.
ReplyDeleteWhen one side lies blatantly and gets caught repeatedly in those lies, to the point of losing a defamation suit, to the point that its own members are ratting it out, to the point of multiple criminal indictments, there is no need for logicians to split hairs over "what is truth." We need to defend truth by calling it Truth, even if Republicans disagree, especially if Republicans disagree. Somerby won't defend Truth.
Not only that, but Somerby does not identify what he considers clueless in Cohen's statement. He doesn't tell us what he thinks Cohen got wrong. He just moans about logicians and calls names ("clueless") while telling us WE have things wrong -- while the right wing continues its ongoing disinformation campaign on behalf of the right wing.
If Somerby were liberal, he would spend time here debunking the smear campaign against Hunter Biden, intended to portray Joe Biden as part of a criminal family. He might also point out the many ways that Trump funneled money to his own children while president, and note that the right accuses the left of whatever it has done itself -- in this case blatant nepotism by putting Ivanka and Jared on staff, coupled with grifting while they enriched themselves at public expense. Somerby might call for an investigation into Trump's children's business activities while in office, and ask why Jared received a $2 billion payoff from the Saudis upon leaving office. And he might point out that all the investigations by the House so far have turned up no evidence against Joe Biden, but that doesn't stop Republicans from repeating their lies.
What does Somerby do instead? He calls Cohen clueless, without telling us which portion of Cohen's remarks he finds wrong. And he equates our side's supposed cluelessness with the other side's blatant, shameless lying, and suggests Trump may win. Because Cohen is clueless in some minor way that Somerby cannot even describe, that requires a logician to sort out, that may lose the left the next election, but Somerby cannot clearly explain?
Somerby perhaps understands that a therapist might call this neurotic. It isnt the way mentally healthy people think.
Don't forget the billion Jared got from Qatar for his 666 Manhattan failure while acting as Trump's mideast peace dude.
DeleteNotice how Somerby hides the topic under discussion, calling Cohen clueless without making it clear that he was referring to the upcoming Trial of Trump on serious charges. This isn't about any old truth. It is about creating a shared context between left and right by letting them hear the trial as it unfolds, share the truth of evidence presented at the trial.
ReplyDeletePerhaps the cluelessness is about the fact that the trial will be an adversarial proceeding, despite being a search for the truth of what happened, and that each side will believe the attorneys on the side they already favor (for or against Trump). Further, the audience watching the trial will not see the jury's deliberations, so they won't know how those people decided which side to believe. So the mechanism for determining truth will be denied viewers, even if they heard arguments by both sides. And I doubt there are many open minds among viewers at this point.
But Somerby coyly hides the topic at hand, referring to it as tomorrow's essay (which may or may not materialize). Why not tell us today what Cohen said that Somerby disagrees with? It would be so simple to do that. Instead he first wants to poison our minds against Cohen -- he is set up as very Jewish and alone among legislators in Memphis (and TN?). But Somerby is afriad to tell us what makes him think Cohen is clueless. We don't get to make up our own minds about that -- we are just told he is clueless and we must ruminate on that over night and maybe Somerby will say something about why tomorrow, or maybe he won't. He could stretch this out for 6-1/2 weeks, as he did with the MS NAEP scores. Or not tell us at all, having maligned Cohen without ever saying why. Because that is what Somerby does.
He's probably referring to the comments they made about CNN and MSNBC representing some kind of "truth", versus information given by Fox or Newsmax.
DeleteStudies have found CNN and MSNBC to have millions of fewer viewers than Fox and other right wing news outlets, but that they are massively more informed than viewers of right wing news outlets like Fox and Newsmax.
DeleteAs other commenters have noted, Somerby and his blog serve little more than as a case study for psychologists and other social scientists.
Bob has said zero about Fox’s three quarters of a billion dollar pay out for lying about the election. What a great media watchdog! 😊
DeleteSomerby's description of Cohen makes me wish I lived in Memphis and could vote for him.
ReplyDeleteCNN and MSNBC are full of disinformation and disinformation agents spreading it. You cannot trust that what they tell you is the truth.
ReplyDeleteAre you a logician? If not, who cares what you say?
DeleteThey reported Tucker's laptop was Malaysian disinformation. But it turned out the laptop was real.
DeleteThe laptop is real but the information on it may not be. Too many weirdos have had access to it, to claim that what is on it is necessarily real. Even photos can be faked these days.
DeleteWhen Cnn and MSNBC originally said the whole story was disinformation, that wasn't an accurate representation of the truth. So we all have to be careful. For all we know, Fox reported that it was real and the whole story wasn't disinformation and that would make Fox News right and CNn wrong.
DeleteFor all we know, the laptop had the cure for cancer on it, but Republicans wiped the hard drive clean.
DeleteSpeculation is fun!
Ome can say that CNN was spreading disinformation by telling its viewers that the laptop was disinformation.
DeleteCNN shouldn't have called it "disinformation" unless they had proof.
DeleteThe entire media is free to ignore the laptop story, because there is no chain of custody, so anyone could have added or removed files.
Besides, none of the folks making claims about Joe Biden's corruption in the media, will do so under oath.
Until the media finds the fire, best to ignore all the hot air.
"CNN shouldn't have called it "disinformation" unless they had proof." But they did which makes it spectacularly clueless to refer to them as some sort of source of truth.
DeleteThis is the (corporate) media that tried to sell the idea that Trump voters were economically anxious. Trust them at your own peril.
DeletePundits on CNN speculated that some of the laptop contents may have been part of Russian disinformation, and similar speculation was made on Fox as well, since the FBI was investigating this very thing, and in fact, this may be the case.
DeleteRegardless, Trump tried to use the laptop as an October surprise in 2020, but it failed, and it continues to fail to gain traction due to multiple investigations that have failed to show any illegality or corruption on the part of Joe Biden.
Fox, CNN, MSNBC are all more alike than their differences - they are all corporate media pushing neoliberalism; however, as others have noted, viewers of Fox and other directly right wing media are far more misinformed than viewers of the more centrist outlets such as CNN and MSNBC.
Correct 3:11. But note Bob has jumped on the Hunter train is sleaziest possible way.
DeletePeople are suggesting that the contents of the laptop that indicate President Biden was helping orchestrate access deals through his son and communist business leaders with whom he was engaged in diplomacy was actually planted there by China, through Giuliani. Which makes perfect sense.
DeleteMultiple investigations, led by Republicans, failed to find Joe Biden was involved or helped with any of Hunter’s business deals, so it’s moot whether it was planted by China or Russia.
DeleteI'm just not into a drug addicts dic pics, even if he is the son of the President. I'm weird that way.
DeleteThere was a document in there about paying 10% to the "big guy" who it has been suggested is actually the president. Whoever this big guy is or was the arrangement was to be that Hunter would get their share and he would pass it on to them. And so that was planted by China or maybe Malaysia. Because investigations have eliminated the possibility of any wrongdoing on behalf of Biden.
DeleteThe big guy is obviously Trump.
DeleteThere was an email referencing a deal with a Chinese company, but the deal didn’t go through.
DeleteAfter multiple investigations by the Republicans, there was no illegality or corruption by Joe Biden found.
Whether some of these emails were planted by Russians, or Trump, or some other entity, is unknown and not being investigated by the Republicans.
This issue has failed to gain traction with the media and with voters because it is yet another nothingburger.
According to Google Trends people have become very interested in Hunter Biden over the last few months.
DeleteNot people. Trolls are trying desperately to smear Joe Biden. Look at the increase in troll traffic here, trying to create interest in the laptop or sports car. Paid trolls or bots are not real traffic or interest. They couldn't get anyone to bite on their annoying comments here.
DeleteIf the document is real it doesn't reflect very well on Joe Biden.
DeleteAfter multiple investigations, and millions spent, the Republicans failed to find Joe Biden involved in any illegality or corruption.
DeleteRussia may have been involved in spreading disinformation against Biden in order to help Trump, but the Republicans have not investigated the issue.
Checking Google Trend demonstrates there has not been elevated interest in Hunter Biden over the past 5 years - it’s been pretty much a flat line; the biggest spike, which was tiny relative to average internet traffic, was in May 2020, and then there was a small one day spike on July 30 2023, although that was interest in the judge in his case, not him specifically. So the claim about elevated interest is false.
It's been pretty much a flat line except for a small one day spike?
Delete628 yes that was the day "multiple investigations" closed. Lol.
DeleteThe claim is that people have become very interested in Hunter over the past few months as indicated by Google Trend; however, checking Google Trend, this claim is false - there was a small spike in May 2020, and an even smaller spike in July 30 2023, otherwise it’s been a flat line, therefore the claim is false, there has not been an elevated interest in Hunter at all.
DeleteThe excrement lately coming off of Bobby's keyboard attracted its fair share of right wing trolls yesterday (and no, to answer one, I won't be voting for Kennedy because of the current employment numbers). Perhaps that is the direction this blog is being driven in. For those of us who can tell the difference between truth and fiction- and here's a clue, fiction pays out hundreds of millions in slander awards- this place isn't worth visiting anymore. Bobby, grow up for crissake. And no, you aren't one of "us", thankfully.
ReplyDeleteAs a black Democrat, I'm warming up to RFK. I like what he's saying about getting us out of our involvement in Ukraine.
DeleteSure you are.
Delete11:42,
DeleteWhat did RFK say?
That he wants to use the money we are currently sending to Ukraine to pay black Americans reparations for slavery?
That is worth warming to.
Please provide the link.
RFK say’s ludicrous things, changes them when called out, then claims he is being repressed. So even if he DID say that, I wouldn’t take it too seriously.
DeleteAs a black Democrat, I am rejecting RFK jr, due to his right wing neoliberal stance and support of right wing conspiracy theories. That he supports Putin over Ukraine makes me dislike him even more. That he engages in harmful racist rhetoric is yet another reason why I reject him as a candidate.
DeleteTo be frank, RFK jr seems demented, and I hope he finds competent mental health professionals that can help him find some peace of mind.
As a black person, I find it odd that Somerby has pointedly ignored the Montgomery Alabama boat brawl, where some right wingers tried to attack a black boat worker just doing his job, but then they got stomped when other nearby black people came to his defense.
The people who call in to CSPAN are not a random sample of the voting public. They are people with the leisure to call such a show. Who has the time? Paid shills and party operatives, retired people, people on disability, unemployed people. Not working people or women with kids. That makes these opinions that Somerby takes so seriously somewhat unrepresentative. They probably skew male and conservative. Some conservatives call in on the left and independent lines, preventing each side from having an equal chance to express their views. Wide segments of the electorate are not being heard there, just as the people who write letters to the NY Times are not typical or representative either. I've seen no sign that Somerby understands this.
ReplyDelete"Our public discourse is very primitive—and that's just among us blues!"
ReplyDeleteAnother gratuitous insult supported by no evidence. "Me Tarzan, you Jane." That's primitive. "But I'm just a humble neanderthal lawyer, what do I know about trials?" That's primitive too.
Somerby always gives a token statement that he doesn't like Trump and the red tribe is worse, before launching all torpedoes against liberals. With friends like this who needs enemies? Somerby is about as believable as the guy who says he's a black Democrat warming up to RFK Jr.
Since we are talking about Truth, there is none here in what Somerby writes.
I'm a black Democrat I feel that Democrats need to be more committed than ever to empowering young women and transgender POC to have the confidence to speak their minds and live their truth. Even if that means standing up against war when it is uncomfortable and goes against the crowd.
Delete12:33,
DeleteI think Democrats should support providing black Americans with reparations for slavery, and if they don't I'll vote for a different party that does.
Any takers?
What Party would that be?
DeleteYes. Bob’s writing and arguments have become juvenile to an extent it once would not have seemed possible.
DeleteThose of us who do not, for whatever reason, think that Donald Trump should be excused from his criminal behavior, should take some solace in fhat Bob can’t formulate an argument here that a third grader couldn’t get past. (You say two and two are for, but others disagree with you!) Where Bob actually disagrees with those who would grant Trump the powers of a king is not easily located anymore. He had repeated every silly notion that has been raised in Trumps defense.
ReplyDeleteObviously defeated by the Jan 6 committee, Bob snorted that there were no Republicans on the committee and left the field. Again, siding with the Party who clearly attempted to install Trump over the heads of the voters.
The “Truth” in question here, which Bob attempts to portray as hubris on the part of Trump’s foes, is simply the truth that Trump lost the election. Just like he lost the popular vote to Hillary. Just like he lost the Iowa Primary to Cruz. Just like he lost the Emmy for his asinine TV Show. These are all things he claimed he won and were rigged against him. It is not mentioned near enough that Trump ALWAYS lies in these situations. He always will.
Bob’s argument, such as it is, is if we were just nicer in the face of whatever mendacity, once mean and now cruel, the Right is serving up things will go better and we will win. This would seem silly on the face of it, and I welcome any example that would indicate it’s true.
“They just sit there and take it!” Bob once railed at liberals who seemed passive in the face of abuse. But it’s clear now Bob WANTED them to sit there and take it. Why? So he could deride them for sitting there and taking it. It’s the American way.
Bob’s taunts about Trump winning again are nothing new. He often threatened Obama in this fashion if he thought Obama was getting too big for his britches. But Obama got tougher and won re-election.
The average liberal has nothing to say about Trump’s upcoming trials. It’s a matter for the Courts now. Bob’s pals, obviously a bunch of amoral creeps, are going to have some hard nights. There are many questions from Trump’s Presidency we have yet to get near. (The Pardons? The Convention at the White House? The two billion to Jarard?) Maybe never will.
Could decent Americans ever tell Bob to stick it forcefully enough?
Agree, well said!
DeletePart of the difference is how facts are interpreted. Everyone agrees that David Weiss was appointed as a Special Prosecutor to investigate Hunter. Liberal media see no problem. Conservative media see this as part of a corrupt coverup.
ReplyDeleteConservatives initially requested him. Now they complain.
DeleteDavid and other conservatives are just getting their excuses ready when nothing is found again.
DeleteI tip my hat to you, David, remembering how you smugly predicted Donald J Chickenshit would never be indicted. Bravo! Take a bow.
DeleteLiberals think it’s corrupt to lie about who your cousin is, but right wingers sometimes get frustrated when liberals call them out on their corruption.
ReplyDeleteWhen you lie about who your cousin is, David, some may see that as a corrupt coverup for lacking coherence, and lacking morality.
Dear @4:13 -- A person could actually verify that Lizzie is my cousin based on clues contained in my comments. Are you up to the challenge?
DeleteThe clues are: you found her kid’s name and her husband’s name via Wikipedia (her kid’s name is in a reference link on Wikipedia).
DeleteYou wrongly claim that people do not call her Liz, but oops, in an article you didn’t read, she says her friends and family call her Liz. Oops
“Lizzie” is not your cousin, and she finds it creepy and weird that you lie about it.