tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post2560525110395561330..comments2024-03-28T21:42:44.372-04:00Comments on the daily howler: CAN WE TALK: Al Gore was told to stay in his car at the Salem witch trials!<b>bob somerby</b>http://www.blogger.com/profile/02963464534685954436noreply@blogger.comBlogger55125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-90526330411324363602013-07-12T22:20:57.835-04:002013-07-12T22:20:57.835-04:00Anon 727,
Since you asked, it's sleazy becau...Anon 727, <br /><br />Since you asked, it's sleazy because it of the dishonest and corrupt and disreputable aspects --nobody can take seriously on the merits any recommendations or appointments Lewinsky received after her affair with WJC, they are all tainted by the inappropriate workplace behavior. And while sex, of course, is not necessarily shabby or vulgar, I would be amazed if there were a shabbier or more vulgar escapade by a President in the Oval office. <br /><br />Would WJC's sleazy personal behavior affect me voting for him? Probably not. But that doesn't mean I think his actions were sophisticated, mature and entirely wholesome. <br /><br />I don't think you can elect a Weiner or Spitzer without recognizing that most people think they are sleazy. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-13782594298818034472013-07-12T19:37:19.817-04:002013-07-12T19:37:19.817-04:00If Trayvon was going home from the 7-11 he would h...If Trayvon was going home from the 7-11 he would have reached that home long before any of this happened. He spent 45 minutes between leaving his home and being spotted by Zimmerman -- doing what? He was 100 ft from his front door yet took 4 minutes from the point where he was last seen running to when he encountered Zimmerman -- again, doing what? Anyone going home would have been home. What was Trayvon doing? Not just eating skittles. You keep mentioning that he was 17. How is that relevant to anything when kids much younger not only shoot each other in gang killings but are tried as adults for it. Age does not confer innocence, especially when you have the circumstances in this situation. The jury may not have been allowed to see Trayvon's phone contents or know about his marijuana use or his school suspension, the texts about fighting, the prior behavior problems, but the rest of us do know about these things. Portraying every wayward teen as an honor student is just dishonest.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-46482889919735566952013-07-12T19:27:13.226-04:002013-07-12T19:27:13.226-04:00Sex isn't dirty, vulgar, tawdry in my opinion....Sex isn't dirty, vulgar, tawdry in my opinion. I don't see what he did as dishonest or corrupt either, not in the way taking a bribe or cronyism would be. The man accepted a blow job offered by a friendly young woman. How is that sleazy?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-10014864827585326892013-07-12T15:32:53.562-04:002013-07-12T15:32:53.562-04:00Are trolls sociopaths?
Just askin'.Are trolls sociopaths?<br /><br />Just askin'.gravymeisterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16075831177588700301noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-74886208125233381442013-07-12T13:37:01.630-04:002013-07-12T13:37:01.630-04:00**there is NOTHING so far in evidence that says Zi...**there is NOTHING so far in evidence that says Zimmerman didn't stop following. Nothing.**<br /><br />Except for the fact that he ended up killing the boy shortly thereafter<br /><br />**And naturally, you desperately want to ignore this fact: the dispatcher previously directly asked Zimmerman to do things that amounted to following Martin. Directly asked him to do it. What's your spin on that, liar?**<br /><br />Horseshit. You're creating a narrative. Naughty naughty. There is nothing in the questions the dispatcher asked him that implies they wanted Z (not a cop) to follow. Why then would he immediately tell him "ok, we don't need you to do that" after he asked him if Z was following him?The dispatcher thought he was talking to someone observing a suspect doing something wrong. He didn't realize he was talking to a dumb ass following a 17 year old boy going home from the 7-11. And the dispatcher certainly didn't know that Z was packing a loaded weapon while doing that.<br /><br /><br />mmnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-65805057855033107822013-07-12T12:57:00.648-04:002013-07-12T12:57:00.648-04:00Nobody's "insisting" on that, mm -- ...Nobody's "insisting" on that, mm -- you liar. <br /><br />What anyone who is paying attention to the facts is saying is that there is NOTHING so far in evidence that says Zimmerman didn't stop following. Nothing.<br /><br />Also you are the one who want to ignore the evidence for a narrative.<br /><br />You say "Zimmerman was clearly told to stop following-not in those exact words." You're damn right, not! We know what the exact words were: "we don't need you to do that." And there's NO evidence whatsoever that he continued to follow Martin from that point.<br /><br />And naturally, you desperately want to ignore this fact: the dispatcher previously directly asked Zimmerman to do things that amounted to following Martin. Directly asked him to do it. What's your spin on that, liar?<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-82833919165659237412013-07-12T10:54:47.872-04:002013-07-12T10:54:47.872-04:00Yeah, they deputized him, Officer George "Bar...Yeah, they deputized him, Officer George "Barney Fife" Zimmerman. Except, they didn't realize he had more than one bullet and kept one chambered in his pistol.<br /><br />I never said that Georgie Porgie was told that night to "stay in the truck". What you refuse to address is the neighborhood watch training he had that said you don't carry a weapon and you don't follow potential suspects.<br /><br />And he was clearly told to stop following-not in those exact words but the instructions were clear. It's undeniable since he and his ardent defenders have been insisting that he turned around when the operator said, "OK, we don't need you to do that"mmnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-65318977212077211012013-07-12T07:57:08.097-04:002013-07-12T07:57:08.097-04:00More made-up crap from mm. Typical.
Wanting to a...More made-up crap from mm. Typical. <br /><br />Wanting to adhere to the facts in evidence in the case is "just another narrative" to sad mm.<br /><br />And of course though Zimmerman was never told to "stay in the truck" and never told "don't follow him" he was in fact told "watch him" and he was in fact told to see where Martin was. <br /><br />In actual effect, prior to the "we don't need you to do that" conversation, the dispatcher was telling Zimmerman to follow Martin.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-77794064066275915592013-07-12T00:01:22.178-04:002013-07-12T00:01:22.178-04:00There are narratives galore being spun around here...There are narratives galore being spun around here. It seems you only object to narratives that aren't flattering to Georgie Porgie, the guy walking around with a pistol loaded with hollow point bullets, one of which somehow ended up in a young boys heart and lung.<br /><br />***It is entirely compatible with the interpretation "You don't need me to, but you aren't telling me not to."***<br /><br />If you can listen to the recording of the non-emergency operator and accept the above as a reasonable interpretation of what the operator was communicating to little georgie porgie, <br />(he's just so adorable, like a Pillsbury dough boy packing a 9mm with a bullet chambered) then you and I don't speak the same language.<br /><br />If that is such a reasonable interpretation, why is it n that Zimmerman now insists that he turned around to return to his truck when the operator said that to him? <br /><br />***The operator should have said "If you shoot that kid, no matter what the circumstances, your life will be ruined, so get in your truck, lock the doors and drive away as fast as you can."***<br /><br />It's almost amusing how you keep avoiding the fact that the neighborhood watch training was very clear about following potential suspects. You don't do it. You let the police do their job. This is a tragedy that didn't have to happen but for the fact that Georgie ignored that rule because he didn't want that effing punk to get away this time. <br /><br />***He was never told to "do" anything in that often misquoted exchange with a non-emergency city phone operator. He wasn't even told "not to do" anything. He was told what the operator felt was not needed...to have Zimmerman following the person he reported acting suspiciously.***<br /><br />You left out the part where they deputized little Pee Wee Herman on the phone.mmnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-36503787734271698582013-07-11T23:27:35.019-04:002013-07-11T23:27:35.019-04:00Anon 153,
Well, who did debunk the 16 words from...Anon 153, <br /><br />Well, who did debunk the 16 words from Bush's State of the Union speech? Here's what they think over at Mother Jones:<br /><br /> In July 2003, several months after the speech, former ambassador Joe Wilson published his famous New York Times column explaining why he thought the line was bogus. The day after Wilson published his article, Bush press secretary Ari Fleischer told the media that the information on "yellow cake" had turned out to be "incorrect." CIA Director George Tenet took the blame for the line later that day: "These 16 words should never have been included in the text written for the President."<br /><br />Merriam Webster says "Definition of DEBUNK<br />: to expose the sham or falseness of"<br /><br />Are you going to claim that Ari Fleischer debunked the 16 words? Or do you believe that Bush's statement in the 2003 State of the Union address that “The British Government has learned that Saddam Hussein recently sought significant quantities of uranium from Africa ” was, in fact, true?<br /><br />http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2011/01/state-of-the-union-bush-16-wordsAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-83914891342020291432013-07-11T21:36:32.718-04:002013-07-11T21:36:32.718-04:00Frankly, I envy the bastards (and let's never ...Frankly, I envy the bastards (and let's never forget the wimmenfolk who are also in their dastardly ranks). It must be so liberating not to have a conscience. Hieronymus Braintreehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05303938809800287873noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-45097996378653308522013-07-11T21:36:09.073-04:002013-07-11T21:36:09.073-04:00Cecelia -- Romney is very wealthy now, but I'm...Cecelia -- Romney is very wealthy now, but I'm not so sure he was fabulously wealthy many years ago when the dog event took place.David in Calnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-76498933594835691642013-07-11T20:35:31.324-04:002013-07-11T20:35:31.324-04:00OK, I got the name wrong. The important thing is t...OK, I got the name wrong. The important thing is that I remembered he had the name of a Mick. <br /><br />Strapping a dog securely into a travel kennel with wind protection is not bad judgement. <br /><br />IF we're going to strap Gail Collins to anything, might I suggest some heavily-traveled railroad tracks?Hieronymus Braintreehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05303938809800287873noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-88129924452291890582013-07-11T20:29:04.949-04:002013-07-11T20:29:04.949-04:00Here are links to some photos taken of Zimmerman t...Here are links to some photos taken of Zimmerman the day he was arrested: <br /><br />http://blog.al.com/live/2012/10/orlando_sentinel_george_zimmer.html<br /><br />http://abcnews.go.com/US/george-zimmerman-return-jail-bail-revoked-trayvon-martin/story?id=16484963#.Ud9MC0GTic0<br /><br />I dunno. He looks sorta pudgy to me, Dude. Especially that side shot. If you can't see a 17 year-old football player outrunning him you probably need to have a reasonable imagination implant. Especially the part where someone has you pinned to the ground and seems to be doing a fine job of punching your lights out, which appears to have been EXACTLY what happened. <br /><br /><br />Oh, and Anonymous at 3:34. I agree that there were "some" liberals who were not like that. Me for example. But, overwhelmingly liberals rushed to judgement on this one because they all got hard and wet over the idea of persecuting a white man for racism. Instead of complaining that I'm being unfair, I think you need to face up to the fact that our side is not nearly as unprejudiced as it likes to fancy itself. Hieronymus Braintreehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05303938809800287873noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-47226821321815874382013-07-11T19:18:20.632-04:002013-07-11T19:18:20.632-04:00I'm not sure what's real or not real about...I'm not sure what's real or not real about the dog thing.<br /><br />I do know it's terrible judgment to have a dog on top of the car. Sigh...<br /><br />What I do find curious is that people of the Romney's wealth and status didn't have a caravan of assistants, nannies, trainers, cook/s going with them on vacation. That the dog couldn't have ridden shotgun in some employee's car in a Romney caravan.<br /><br />It is worth noting that it seems to hsve been only Ma, Pa, the kids, and the poor dog.<br /><br />Would those dynamics be the same for Gail Collins?CeceliaMchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16017255006204800193noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-86553660116324127942013-07-11T18:38:53.381-04:002013-07-11T18:38:53.381-04:00Anon 518,
What would a person in WJC's posit...Anon 518, <br /><br />What would a person in WJC's position as President have to do in order for you to call that behavior "sleazy?" <br /><br />Here's some help to start you off:<br /><br />slea·zy (slz)<br />adj. slea·zi·er, slea·zi·est<br />1.<br />a. Shabby, dirty, and vulgar; tawdry<br />b. Dishonest or corrupt; disreputableAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-66072992000932153922013-07-11T18:36:49.598-04:002013-07-11T18:36:49.598-04:00It is a lot easier to construct your favorite narr...It is a lot easier to construct your favorite narrative about this event when you get to make up dialog and place it into the minds and mouths of witnesses.<br /><br />The operator should have said "If you shoot that kid, no matter what the circumstances, your life will be ruined, so get in your truck, lock the doors and drive away as fast as you can." 20/20 hindsight is wonderful. Maybe the operator was actually thinking "I hope that kid isn't planning to burglarize my place. The cops better get there quick." or perhaps "Hmmm, only 30 more minutes until my shift is over and I can get out of this place and get some dinner." or perhaps "George, you did such a good job catching the last burglar, we wouldn't want you to get hurt, so let the cops take care of this, OK?" Why on earth would the operator think he was a "reckless dumb fuck" when his past behavior showed no tendency toward such behavior, when he had been instrumental in catching and convicting a burglar via his neighborhood watch activities, when he was friendly and well-thought of by police (based on their testimony) and when there was no evidence he was doing ANYTHING reckless, especially if you assume Trayvon was an innocent teen just strolling along and enjoying his skittles? Biases come in all shapes and sizes.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-75911879855242492502013-07-11T17:39:36.889-04:002013-07-11T17:39:36.889-04:00Actually, we do define workplace sex as being more...Actually, we do define workplace sex as being more fraught with problems. Problems concerning power imbalances, favoritism, etc.<br /><br />Having then Ambassador to the UN, Bill Richardson offer Lewinsky a job might be seen as a bit suggestive of the sort of dynamic that might make other young careerist question where they went wrong.CeceliaMchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16017255006204800193noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-6259440845019390142013-07-11T17:21:37.049-04:002013-07-11T17:21:37.049-04:00Speak for yourself.Speak for yourself.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-9807473127127681872013-07-11T17:18:33.846-04:002013-07-11T17:18:33.846-04:00I sincerely doubt the efficiency of multitasking d...I sincerely doubt the efficiency of multitasking during sex, but I don't otherwise see any harm in it, no matter where it occurs. The Oval Office is just a workplace, especially to those who work there. 2 is no worse than 1 -- that is like arguing that a priest abusing an altar boy commits a worse crime when he does so inside church than outside church. Is adultery worse when it occurs in the marriage bed? I don't think so, but some people do. I think that is supposedly one of the differences between liberals and conservatives -- and I think it is why bigots believe Obama has defiled the White House simply by living there, why some people thought Clinton defiled the White House by allowing campaign donors to stay in the Lincoln bedroom. Years ago, I thought Nixon defiled it when he put in a bowling alley, but then I grew up. Psychologist Paul Rozin did a study showing that people would not wear a sweater they had been told belonged to Hitler, even if it had been dry cleaned. They have odd ideas, such as that evil is like having cooties and can be caught by wearing a sweater or that places can acquire moral germs or be defiled by what people say, do or even think in them. You must cringe every time aliens blow up a replica of the White House in some movie -- it is only a model and the house itself, symbolic of our government, is still only a building where people live their lives for 4-8 years and then depart. Expecting them to be symbolic too while living there is unreasonable, in my opinion. I feel truly sorry for Michelle Obama, who has had to suppress any individuality in order to conform to the image of the perfect white house spouse in order to avoid disappointing a nation of idiots who think that if she farts in the oval office the free world will tremble. If LBJ's dog once pooped on the Oval office rug, does that diminish his presidency? I don't think so and I have no trouble respecting the accomplishments of Bill Clinton despite his personal behavior, which I would not myself engage in regardless of where I worked.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-30110832259221950902013-07-11T16:25:11.724-04:002013-07-11T16:25:11.724-04:00IMHO the fact that the act occurred in the non-res...IMHO the fact that the act occurred in the non-residential part of the White House made it worse. Consider two examples:<br /><br />1. George and Laura have sex in the residential part of the White House<br /><br />2. George and Laura have sex in the Oval Office, while George is on the phone doing official Presidential business.<br /><br />Obviously #2 is worse than #1. David in Calnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-77487088884512317222013-07-11T16:18:07.230-04:002013-07-11T16:18:07.230-04:00What I find utterly weird is that you refer to &qu...What I find utterly weird is that you refer to "Zim" as pudgy, when the "investigation video" you refer to showed him to be quite trim at the time of the shooting. So trim in fact he might easily have wriggled out of that MMA death straddle pinning his arms to his side so he could quickly grab his gun that the strapping young footballer was also trying to grab from beneath his own legs, pull it out and shoot the fatal bullet.<br /><br />The fact that you thought he was a slob indicates you may have missed watching the video. Otherwise you would know it strongly indicates nothing more than Zimmerman recounting his side of the story for police after the fact.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-63997578476908514032013-07-11T16:08:49.041-04:002013-07-11T16:08:49.041-04:00I think the headline is accurate. I think the fol...I think the headline is accurate. I think the following quote from the article can be fairly summarized as "Bloom Says Zimmerman Prosecution Needs To Go Hard On The Racial Angle In Summation".<br /><br /><i>She [Bloom] said that proceedings thus far have been clinical and have avoided dwelling on the implication that Zimmerman’s racial profiling of Martin led to their fatal confrontation. Bloom advised the prosecution to focus heavily on the racial angle in summation.</i> <br />David in Calnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-62200830212054001792013-07-11T16:07:16.023-04:002013-07-11T16:07:16.023-04:00As I recall this story, it was one told by Romney ...As I recall this story, it was one told by Romney to a reporter in 2007 in an effort to humanize his otherwise aloof image when first running for President.<br /><br />But I could indeed be misremebering. I thought his name was Seamus, and that by the time Romeny recounted the story Semus had been crated again and shipped off to California to live with Romney's sister where he died a happy, kitten protecting pooch with plenty of territory to roam free.<br /><br />I also must be misremembering Barney. I thought he was Bush's reporter biting pup.<br />Gone to the great hound heaven as well I misremember.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-71575277925525069032013-07-11T15:53:50.946-04:002013-07-11T15:53:50.946-04:00Oh please! The operator was just be polite. What...Oh please! The operator was just be polite. What he should have said, after realizing to his horror, that contrary to all his previous training z was following would been something liike, " stop following him you reckless dumb fuck or someone is going to get hurt"<br /><br />Better?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com