tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post6612563690353596425..comments2024-03-28T18:27:32.942-04:00Comments on the daily howler: Andrew Sullivan, peckish and peeved!<b>bob somerby</b>http://www.blogger.com/profile/02963464534685954436noreply@blogger.comBlogger52125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-79421047226918838492014-02-06T09:56:25.514-05:002014-02-06T09:56:25.514-05:00So up thread you/someone said:
"My point is,...So up thread you/someone said:<br /><br />"My point is, Bob thought it was worth reporting on his blog on Dec. 13, but didn't take due diligence. He merely repeated what he read. The same "groupthink" he has been complaining about for lo, these 16 years."<br /><br />I disgree with that premise. Bob is not a reporter, does not need to sort through or cite all the reports on a single story when he's trying to sum it up in two paragraphs. It's different for a reporter to insert scripts and novelize their reports than for Bob to quote a paper like the NYT as a way to summarize a story he's commenting on (commenting on, not reporting on). <br /><br />This isn't a newspaper. It's a blog about the media. <br /><br />Rather than ask who is the rube, I'd ask whether you see a difference between Bob and a reporter. Between TDH and the NYT. <br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-62226617677028550852014-02-06T08:07:31.071-05:002014-02-06T08:07:31.071-05:00So Bob has been howling about how undependable the...So Bob has been howling about how undependable the NYT is, then used the NYT as his sole source for his summation about the Christie scandal.<br /><br />Who is the rube?<br /><br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-75585141597427678862014-02-05T19:17:33.990-05:002014-02-05T19:17:33.990-05:00The Cooper panel show could be even worse than any...The Cooper panel show could be even worse than anything on MSNBC, if that's possible.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-2344171932638404422014-02-05T16:13:07.811-05:002014-02-05T16:13:07.811-05:00"Final note: Today, they’re doing this to Chr..."Final note: Today, they’re doing this to Christie. Next year, they’ll be doing it to someone you support, as they’ve done many times in the past."<br /><br />Yes. These folks make the IRS and NSA look like pikers.<br /><br />They ruin and destroy without blinking an eye. Right, left, and in between, we are all collateral damage to their ambition.CeceliaMchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16017255006204800193noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-19957091160535439952014-02-05T15:02:21.500-05:002014-02-05T15:02:21.500-05:00Bob wrote on 12/13-
"Here’s the background:...Bob wrote on 12/13- <br /><br />"Here’s the background:" - if you click that phrase it takes you to the 12/10 NYT article about Christie and the GWB.<br /><br />Then he continued -<br />"Back in September, a minor New Jersey official had closed three lanes of traffic from Fort Lee onto the George Washington Bridge. This created a week-long traffic jam which crippled the town of Fort Lee.<br /><br />The minor official was a high school friend of Christie’s...etc"<br /><br />I read that as he's citing a source and summing it up. <br /><br />Because, again, he's not a reporter and he's doing media criticism on a free blog. <br /><br />I've never read him do anything but call reporting an important part of democratic life. He just makes a distinction between what he sees as good or bad reporting. It's not they can't get anything right, it's that too often they get things wrong and that has serious consequences for everyone. In any event, your summation of his "mission" seem a bit off the mark.<br /><br />I can see that he seems increasingly nit picky and uber focused on liberals reporting. But he's not neutral. He got a lens that he uses and states constantly. We can disgaree about the utility of that lens but your criticism doesn't really allow for that. <br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-66382953397453005442014-02-05T13:10:45.907-05:002014-02-05T13:10:45.907-05:00You seem to be mistaking "logic" for jud...You seem to be mistaking "logic" for judgment. Zernike had the good judgment to see an important story. Bob didn't. <br /><br />Zernike's reporting does not hang on the closeness of Christie childhood relationships and she doesn't argue that point. Bob pretends that he is making some kind of insightful point when he picks at descriptions of Christie's relationship with Wildstein. But he isn't. He is just creating very minor distractions from the important and useful work that is being done on this scandal by Zernike and many, many others. Once again, Bob displays very poor judgment in discussing the important aspects of these events. <br /><br />How does Bob think the press can play a role in keeping government honest and in service to its constituents? Is it by dreaming up phony excuses for suspicious behavior? Is it by attacking whistleblowers and questioning their motives? <br /><br /><br /><br />Trollmesnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-15074252850057837612014-02-05T11:46:19.236-05:002014-02-05T11:46:19.236-05:00At what point will Bob's fans ever hold him ac...At what point will Bob's fans ever hold him accountable for his own words. No he was not "summing up reporting to date." Those are his own words, and he cited no sources. <br /><br />Now obviously, Bob's information came from reporters. He never does any independent research on his own, at least not any more. <br /><br />But how idiotic is it for a guy who has made it his mission in life to expose how the "mainstream media" can't ever get anything right, then rely on the "mainstream media" as the basis for his summation?<br /><br />It does not even rise to the level of a poor excuse. It is no excuse at all.<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-69005627266792690772014-02-05T11:41:57.868-05:002014-02-05T11:41:57.868-05:00Let's apply your "logic" to an analo...Let's apply your "logic" to an analogy.<br /><br />You want to place bets on NFL games.<br /><br />Tipster A is right 90 percent of the time. Tipster B is wrong 90 percent of the time. But Tipster B tells you Tipster A was wrong about the Chiefs-Broncos game.<br /><br />So naturally, you follow the advice of Tipster B.<br /><br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-90389776559293767762014-02-05T11:21:46.789-05:002014-02-05T11:21:46.789-05:00Perhaps Perez is peckish and peeved at people'...Perhaps Perez is peckish and peeved at people's perceptions of this post?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-73447359129647047762014-02-05T10:03:54.604-05:002014-02-05T10:03:54.604-05:00I don't think Bob needs to issue corrections. ...I don't think Bob needs to issue corrections. On 12/13 he was summing up reporting to date. Further reporting suggested the relationship between Christie and Wildstein was unclear. <br /><br />Today, now that it's obviously unclear, TDH doesn't pretend to know how they knew each other. But either way, mentioning their high school or child hood frienship is unnecessary to build a case against Christie and is lazy reporting.<br /><br />Bob's not a reporter and doesn't run a newspaper. He's one guy with a free blog who does media criticism. <br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-17148695615803670772014-02-05T09:58:34.810-05:002014-02-05T09:58:34.810-05:00Listen to the logic of the troll: Zernike brought ...Listen to the logic of the troll: Zernike brought the story "to light," therefore if she reports Bullshit at any point, Bob should ignore it. because bringing stories "into the light" exonerate reporters from having subsequent bullshit criticized. Seriously troll, do you use logic?Andrichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05112122756372293096noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-29032019596709068192014-02-05T09:44:41.853-05:002014-02-05T09:44:41.853-05:00Bob only poses the problem of cognitive dissonance...Bob only poses the problem of cognitive dissonance to the "rubes" who believe him and are now flailing away like he is to make sense of anything he writes.<br /><br />I also strongly suspect that if Zernike's byline appeared in either the Bergen County Record or the Newark Star-Ledger with the same errors, Bob really wouldn't care.<br /><br />In fact, the only time he mentioned Ted Mann of the Wall Street Journal was when Mann appeared on Maddow's show.<br /><br />And please, let us not pretend that journalism is now or ever has been a perfect science. Everyone makes mistakes in the details as a major story develops. <br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-50219427293166708342014-02-05T09:37:32.437-05:002014-02-05T09:37:32.437-05:00Ok, so a US Attorney leaks info to a 24 year old b...Ok, so a US Attorney leaks info to a 24 year old blogger who works for an unknown party. Right. And said 24 year old investigative reporter can't figure out who signs his own paycheck. Hmmm.<br /><br />Have you ever been written paychecks by unknown parties? Does any of that strike you as plausible?Trollmesnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-80304891405932281602014-02-05T09:37:09.408-05:002014-02-05T09:37:09.408-05:00Especially when you consider that the bullet point...Especially when you consider that the bullet points in the "unreliable" memo come straight from the Bergen County Record's March 2012 profile of Wildstein and how he got such a high-level, created position on the Port Authority.<br /><br />Granted, this was after Wildstein had been on the job, but . . . . if the Record could discover this information in Wildstein's past that now proves how "unreliable" he is, coudln't Christie's people BEFORE they signed off on him?<br /><br /> Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-6544224144225933982014-02-05T09:24:34.797-05:002014-02-05T09:24:34.797-05:00Wait, I've forgotten...did Bob get this Christ...Wait, I've forgotten...did Bob get this Christie story out into the light of day or was it those dang kids, Zernike and Maddow?<br />As I recall, Bob said it wasn't much of a story. So, yeah, that would make Bob a much, much worse problem.Trollmesnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-63665586340335647872014-02-05T09:10:04.155-05:002014-02-05T09:10:04.155-05:00Exactly. Our "reporters" are useless.
...Exactly. Our "reporters" are useless. <br /><br />The much worse problem for our troll crew: Bob Somerby.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-76219549071363816692014-02-05T09:08:39.213-05:002014-02-05T09:08:39.213-05:00KZ, go the fuck away. You are a bad person.KZ, go the fuck away. You are a bad person.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-68584227294999510562014-02-05T08:06:17.218-05:002014-02-05T08:06:17.218-05:00Blame Bob! Zernike sucks because Bob!Blame Bob! Zernike sucks because Bob!Andrichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05112122756372293096noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-42665848865486433402014-02-05T02:04:16.530-05:002014-02-05T02:04:16.530-05:00OMB.
Please. We have noted long before this post...OMB.<br /><br />Please. We have noted long before this post that BOB has not corrected his original description of Wildstein as a high school friend of Christie. Nor has he corrected the notion that Wildstein was "a minor official" when in fact he was the number two man in the Jersey side of the Port Authority, one capable of ordering major alterations of traffic patterns with ease.<br /><br />Neither did he correct, amend or update, as he could have, his post proclaiming Gov. Ultrasound to be uncharged after the indictments were handed down possibly just before, possibly just after, but clearly during the period that post was his latest offering and a glaring monument to his good timing.<br /><br />The examples of such trivialities are easier to uncover than WMD in post "Mission Accomplished" Iraq.<br /><br />But to tell and retell these errors would be to write like BOB.<br /><br />BOB makes no corrections. BOB reads only comments posted elsewhere. Oh, and BOB was a reporter once; one of many vocations he took up with no educational training and later abandoned.<br /><br />None of this makes him a bad person.<br /><br />KZAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-45439827765165981622014-02-05T01:46:04.580-05:002014-02-05T01:46:04.580-05:00OMB
Not to be prissy Bob, but I prefer "puck...OMB<br /><br />Not to be prissy Bob, but I prefer "puckered and pissy" to peckish and peeved.<br /><br />Did Sullivan do anything close to stroking himself like Maddow and Dowd do?<br /><br />KZAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-67831622758615566442014-02-05T01:40:54.746-05:002014-02-05T01:40:54.746-05:00It looks to me like it took you almost a half hour...It looks to me like it took you almost a half hour just to come up with another one line addition to your first.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-71639523253068150992014-02-05T01:01:29.027-05:002014-02-05T01:01:29.027-05:00Ok. I understand the point now. But I'm not ...Ok. I understand the point now. But I'm not pissed at Bob. He's not a reporter, he sums up existing reporting and talks about how reporters report.<br /><br />And in this case, he was right and they were lazy. And that laziness and carelessness with relatively inconsequential facts that are used to shade and fill in a story are frustrating. <br /><br />Those people are supposed to be reporting. But they use those little made up facts to script a story and support their arguments. Because they're too lazy to actually do their job and be prepared.<br /><br />As for the mind reading thing, "peckish" thing. It doesn't bug me. That's the voice of TDH. I doubt Bob actually speaks like that or writes like that all the time. But again Bob's not a reporter. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-66252685494568745682014-02-05T00:30:12.270-05:002014-02-05T00:30:12.270-05:00Wildstein did not do reporting on his blog, and be...Wildstein did not do reporting on his blog, and because he was anonymous, nobody knew how to leak to him anyway. Duh.<br /><br />Christie phoned up and emailed the named reporters, like Kornacki. There's no reason he'd have had any contact with Wildstein at all while that site was operating, and even if he did, he wouldn't have known who he was dealing with. Even Kornacki didn't know until near the end of his job there.gyrfalconnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-50617579338944717502014-02-05T00:27:14.606-05:002014-02-05T00:27:14.606-05:00Oh, for crying out loud. It's a mistake, and ...Oh, for crying out loud. It's a mistake, and mistakes, especially about basically inconsequential things, get repeated and perpetuated by lazy people.gyrfalconnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8611810694571930415.post-83441165749180588232014-02-05T00:24:54.005-05:002014-02-05T00:24:54.005-05:00FYI, anybody who read NYTimes stories on subjects ...FYI, anybody who read NYTimes stories on subjects they knew something about at least as far back as the early '70s, when I started reading it, quickly learned how crappy and error-laden their reporting was. It was, to put it mildly, disillusioning. And I'm not talking about opinions, just at the time the NYT's patented dry as dust factual reporting of events. They got it wrong *all the time*.gyrfalconnoreply@blogger.com