FRIDAY, JULY 10, 2026
Refuses to say their names: Can our form of government, can our nation, "long endure?"
President Lincoln floated the question at Gettysburg. Today, we're involved in a great societal war which raises the question again.
Will we be able to find our way "back out of all this now too much for us?" We've been asking that question for years at this site.
As he starts this essay for The Atlantic, Professor Rosen joins us in not being real sure. Just to refresh you, we'll show you his headlines again:
IDEAS
American Democracy Wasn’t Designed for This
Can our 18th-century institutions survive 21st-century technology?
In his essay, Rosen suggests the possibility that our democracy won't survive the influence of a set of new technologies. We've been telling you that for years. We think his aim is true.
"The important question: whether societies of men are really capable or not of establishing good government from reflection and choice."
Are we humans really capable of engaging in cool, clear reason? Rosen describes "a central premise of the Enlightenment," a premise he says the founders shared:
"Ordinary human beings are capable of recognizing truth on their own."
According to Rosen, the founders generally believed that. We humans have the capacity to sit down and reason together.
Today, though, we're mired in a tribal propaganda war which has largely given the lie to that cheerful notion. We humans believe the darndest things:
Remarkably large percentages of the population have been persuaded, over the years, that Barack Obama was born in Kenya; that "death panels" were part of the Affordable Care Act; and that Hillary Clinton was involved in a pedophile ring which may have operated out of a Washington pizza shop.
Before that, one of our nation's most famous Christian preachers had peddled a film which suggested that Bill and Hillary Clinton were involved in a long string of murders. In 1994, the nation's leading talk radio host had advanced the notion that Hillary Clinton was somehow involved in the death of Clinton aide Vince Foster.
(On the Fox News Channel, the multimillionaire monster Greg Gutfeld continues to pimp that general framework today. He pimps it night after night.)
How many of us "ordinary human beings" may come to believe such notions and claims? Below, you see the numbers from a recent survey concerning the most significant misapprehension of the past six years:
Half of Republicans say the 2020 election was rigged
This week's Economist/YouGov Poll finds sharp divides in public confidence in U.S. elections, with Democrats and Republicans holding vastly different views on the legitimacy of the 2020 election, the credibility of Donald Trump's recent election-rigging claims, and expectations for the fairness of future elections.
28% of Americans—including half (50%) of Republicans and only 9% of Democrats—believe that the 2020 presidential election was "rigged." Republicans who identify as MAGA supporters are about twice as likely as non-MAGA Republicans to think the election was rigged (66% vs. 32%).
As a result of persistent claims by President Trump, 50% of Republican respondents said they believe that the 2020 election was rigged.
The sitting president has had six years to produce evidence in support of this poisonous claim. Many Americans have failed to notice the fact that he has neglected to do so. And not only that—also this!
[continuing directly from above]
Trump recently claimed that this year's primary elections in California were rigged. One-third (33%) of Americans believe he has concrete evidence to support this claim; 67% think he is just trying to sow doubt in the legitimacy of the elections. Most Republicans (72%) think Trump has [concrete] evidence to support his claims of rigging in California. MAGA Republicans are far more likely than non-MAGA Republicans to believe Trump has evidence of rigging (84% vs. 51%). Only 3% of Democrats think Trump has concrete evidence of the elections being rigged.
How about it? Did the president really produce "concrete evidence" in support of that additional claim? In this survey, 72% of Republicans said they believe that he did.
In many cases, it's hard to prove that a given claim is false. (Old bromide: You can't prove a negative.) Under current arrangements, it may not matter if you do manage to prove, or if you do manage to seem to prove, that a given claim is false.
Quite routinely, it won't matter if you show that some claim is bogus—and Rosen understands why that is.
The founders were fearful of "factions," Rosen writes. (Today, such entities sometimes go by the name of "political parties.")
In Professor Rosen's telling, "Madison believed that the tendency to form factions is 'sown in the nature of man.' " Rosen explains why Madison was optimistic in spite of that belief.
That said, it's plainly true! We humans seem to be wired to split off into rival tribes. And some modern technologies have created a world in which the tendency to split into tribes badly undermines our ability to reason together as an intelligent nation.
He mentions the Internet, and he mentions social media. Such technologies have created an obvious problem, he says. He says the problem is this:
Democracy has been resilient for a long time, but that doesn’t mean it can’t reach a breaking point. Social media is an unprecedented challenge: In every way, it represents the Founders’ nightmare. ...More than any previous communications technology, social media has the effect of herding users into likeminded communities where they never have to hear an opposing point of view. In a 2020 article in Science, 15 psychologists and political scientists wrote that America’s political divisions were being amplified by “popularity-based algorithms that tailor content to maximize user engagement.” If the Founders had been able to spend an hour on X, they would have been a lot less optimistic about human beings’ capacity to govern themselves by reason rather than passion.
According to Professor Rosen, "social media has the effect of herding users into likeminded communities where they never have to hear an opposing point of view." In other words, it has the effect of creating like-minded "factions"—including political parties in which 72% of members believe poisonous claims which almost surely aren't true.
According to Professor Rosen, social media has this effect more than any other new technology. We can't necessarily say that's true.
Unfortunately, and rather strangely, Rosen never mentions talk radio. Also, more tellingly, he never mentions "cable news." And he certainly never says the names of the players who, at present, are undermining the very chance of continuing with a successful version of government "by the people."
Rosen doesn't say their names! As you may have noticed by now, people of his professional class never do.
Tomorrow, we'll explain what we mean by that unflattering comment. Also, we'll visit a world where the corporate messenger Charlie Hurt is eating away at the possibility that government of the people will survive—will long endure, won't "perish from the earth."
Tomorrow: They never say their names
"Refuses to say their names: Can our form of government, can our nation, "long endure?"
ReplyDeletePresident Lincoln floated the question at Gettysburg."
My reading of Lincoln is that he was worrying about the nation enduring, not the democratic form of government. Are the two identical? Of course not. There are other nations who are democratic that would still exist if the USA collapsed and were no longer a union.
Somerby keeps urging us to consider our current political state as a civil war, but (1) no one is fighting as anything other than a metaphor, no shooting, no physical battle lines, (2) our politics is a spectrum, multidimensional, a continuum, not two starkly divided groups as slave vs free was, (3) people live intermixed in both red and blue states much more than in free/slave states, (4) we have a single dictator-wannabe who is threatening both red and blue voters with authoritarian government, that is one enemy vs the people, (5) there was not any crazy leader in the civil war, certainly not Lincoln himself whereas Trump is crazy and has surrounded himself with crazy people, (6) there is now huge corruption, which was not the case in the civil war, (7) billionaires have taken sides, (8) AI is new technology in the wrong hands, which was not the situation in the civil war, (9) there appears to be a war on immigrants, people of color and women, a dynamic not present in the Civil War Lincoln oversaw.
So, why does Somerby persist in asserting such an unworkable comparison? Well, he wants some of Lincoln's stature to rub off (on himself? on Trump?) but the only stature today is with those fighting the president and his cronies, not the Republicans looting our nation. Somerby sounds foolish whenever he brings this up, as if he too were grasping to have Trump appear on Mt. Rushmore right beside Lincoln. No one wants that, and more than we wanted to see Trump defile, damage and destroy the Lincoln reflecting pool. It hurts the people every time Somerby reminds us of what Trump has done to memorials to one of our greatest presidents, a man who gave his life for his country, unlike Trump, who was a draft dodger.
It is offensive every time Somerby brings this up. I wish he would find something else to say about this red/blue conflict.
Speaking of corruption, with these greasy fucks it never ends. "The Trumps aren’t just using their family name to make money. Their companies have received almost a billion $$ in federal contracts – a shocking and unprecedented display of corruption." And they are sucking in tons of illegal money with their fucking crypto bullshit.
Delete"Rosen doesn't say their names! As you may have noticed by now, people of his professional class never do. "
ReplyDeleteThis is a total lie! There are plenty of professors, journalists and writers who DO say names and are not only honest but straightforward in their writing, unlike Somerby himself.
Do they have access to mass media outlets? Are they featured on the TV? In the NYT? In Wapo? In WSJ?
Delete9:59,
DeleteEverybody who criticizes TDH already knows that.
9:59: they have access to the thing that rosen identifies as having the most impact: social media.
DeleteSomerby bemoaning that common folk have access to information/knowledge is very on brand for his right wing agenda.
DeleteRosen's entire point is that social media herds people into barns with other like-minded people. So who are these "professors, journalists and writers" talking to? The already converted. The real value is in reaching the unconverted, who rely on mass media -- where the aforementioned "professors, journalists and writers" do not appear -- as their information sources. And there, they learn that both sides are always at fault, always equally bad, and everything is always and forever "murky."
DeleteThe notion that there are people to convert, certainly as far as electoral politics goes, is false.
DeleteThe US lurched hard right in 1981, and neoliberals like Clinton and Obama did little to change that, which kept corporations and oligarchs relatively satisfied.
It was in part the democratization of media that woke people up, and now the Democratic Party is starting to shift ever so slightly to the left, and the Republicans as well as neoliberal Dems are freaking out.
That is all this panic over social media etc is over, it is just right wingers losing their minds that they might lose a little power.
"The notion that there are people to convert, certainly as far as electoral politics goes, is false."
DeleteThere are no swing voters. I see. People like you were saying the same thing about a "shift" after Obama won in 2008. The reality is there are two sides divided along partisan lines, with a relatively small group of people in the middle who vote according to however their feels at the time of the election go, which is why elections have been so close and flip-floppy for decades now. As for what "scares" Republicans, people they can easily label "communists" and "socialists" ain't it. When such people can win elections anywhere except deep blue regions against a party that has gone off the rails led by a manifestly mentally ill man, you can talk about a "shift," but until then you're indulging in the same jerk-off fantasy "progressives" have been enjoying since Henry Wallace.
Driven primarily by racism, which corporations and wealthy right wingers weaponized, there was a significant partisan realignment in the US over the past 50-60 years. That realignment is essentially now complete, with a highly partisan two party system.
DeleteIf you are in the top 10% racism has paid enormous dividends, so you do not want to hear any kind of criticism related to racism, you want to stifle it.
The power engendered by that realignment to right wingers, and part of that power was used to propagate the largest transfer of wealth in history with $50+ TRILLION being redistributed from the bottom 90% to the top 1%, is now being threatened by what is called the "democratization of media".
If you are a right winger, it is reasonable to be panicked about this issue; if you are not a right winger, you're going to see it as a positive - it is nearly a litmus test along with other issues like woke-ism and cancel culture.
None of these alleged “swing” voters pay any attention to the Washington post or the Wall Street Journal or any other legacy media outlet.
DeleteSarcasm is about as appealing in supporting an argument as a diarrhea sandwich.
DeleteThere continues to be swing voters but they are not significant.
Contemporary elections are primarily determined by who motivates and mobilizes voters the most.
Republicans have an edge with this because the psychology of Republican right wingers means they are highly motivated to vote already.
Dems have been relying on the existence of swing voters since Clinton, and they won some battles but lost the war, because it is a strategy based on a misapprehension.
An emergent wing of the Democratic Party has woken up to this and has been getting better results since around 2018.
Republicans want you to believe that swing voters are significant because it keeps Dems trapped in a bad strategy.
4:16 James Carville, is that you? The 90s are calling. And wipe that spittle off your mouth, that is just gross.
Delete"Contemporary elections are primarily determined by who motivates and mobilizes voters the most."
DeleteThis is grossly, but instructively, incorrect. Contemporary elections are decided by WHOSE VOTERS ARE MOST MOTIVATED, plus where the swing voters go. Transiently motivated voters aren't the kind of people who read blogs, listen to political podcasts, or hang on substack waiting for Heather Cox Richardson's latest musings to drop. They might, though, watch CNN, or read their local paper (which carries articles and opinion pieces from WAPO, NYT, and the WSJ on occasion), and they usually watch the evening news. These are the people who need to be reached, because they are the people who matter. Other than that, they turn out to vote when they're fired up for something, like Trump's incompetence, or the economic collapse of 2007 - 2008. They sure as hell aren't waiting for the "progressive messiah" to get them fired up to vote, because if they were, Bernie Sanders would have been president.
"Talk radio has a massive weekly reach, pulling in roughly 50 million listeners nationwide via 1,700 stations. By contrast, live cable TV news draws smaller but more concentrated daily audiences, with the top-rated network, Fox News Channel, peaking at around 2 to 2.5 million primetime viewers
DeleteHeather Cox Richardson is shallow and conventional.
Delete"Unfortunately, and rather strangely, Rosen never mentions talk radio."
ReplyDeleteTalk radio is dead. No one listens to it. That is why Rosen doesn't mention it. Rosen, unlike Somerby, lives in the present. On the other hand, Somerby never mentions podcasts, the successor to talk radio.
These daily essays should be embarrassing to Somerby but he is too unaware to understand that he is not keeping up with the times, has nothing to say to anyone here, and is wrong, which makes him harmful and offensive.
The GOP kept trying to force automakers to put AM radios in for safety alerts, I mean for Gramps to listen to the local Rush wannabe, and Grandma can listen to the not really Christian's screech about Planned Parenthood eating the fetus'. Not sure if still doing it, but man does the GOP suck ass at every level.
DeleteIf an automaker does not offer CarPlay, I will not buy their products.
Delete
ReplyDeleteThe way elections are run, Bob, it's the people who claim that elections are not rigged are the side that needs to produce concrete evidence.
Just the fact that people casting votes are not asked to provide IDs and proofs of citizenship is a concrete evidence for the "yes, rigged" claim. Capeesh?
How do you prove that something didn't happen?
DeleteWhy do people on the right not understand that comparing signatures with the registration form and the person checking in to vote is the way that voters are ID'd? There is validation of the eligibility of everyone who registers. Photo ID systems are far more expensive to place in every polling place and didn't exist when our voting systems were created. That doesn't mean there is no verification and no checking of who can vote.
Why is it that the idiots who claim the system is rigged know nothing about how the system works?
9:46: Yes? That’s how it is in the court system, defendents must prove the negative, right shit for brains maggot head?
Delete
DeleteRigging elections is the only possible reason for refusing to check IDs, Democrat. Ergo, the elections are rigged. That's all.
Assuming facts not in evidence, maggot infested shit for brains. Go find evidence of “rigging” once you remove your empty skull from orange chickenshit’s fat lying ass
DeleteLegislation that makes voting more difficult needs to be based on proof there is a problem being addressed. After his first win, Trump assembled an "Election Integrity" panel headed by an allywhot had been promoting the idea that there was significant voter fraud. After canvassing the states for evidence of such, the panel disbanded without fanfare. For a party headed by a felon who tried to overturn the results of an election to claim that others engage in voter fraud is ridiculous but of course on brand.
DeleteOnce again, it is so fucking infuriating that the felon was indicted for his attempts to steal the 2020 election,yet never had to face a jury and the American voting public in 2024 were denied the opportunity to evaluate the criminal conspiracy he engaged in, partly because the fucking corrupt supreme court stepped in to block the trial.
DeleteAnd so now, we have to endure the fucking felon lecturing us on election integrity and his cult fans who don't know shit come here yappiing about "rigging" - fuck you dumb lying maggots.
As Democrats, I think we need to give Trump a chance. The price of meat is down.
DeleteReminds me of when the "liberal" NYT asked people to write them letters saying nice things about Trump. We live in a comedy horror film.
DeleteIf it weren’t for republicans being the ones caught cheating and trying to rig elections, there would be no issues with our elections.
Delete10:39 The fucking idiot who the Felon had lead the election integrity investigation to find the non-existent 3M votes he lost the popular vote to Clinton to, was the moron that negotiated the surrender to the Taliban.for Trump. Funny that To be fair, not all Kansans' are as stupid as Pompeo.
DeleteA positive assertion requires proof.
DeleteOnus probandi incumbit ei qui dicit, non ei qui negat
Of all the horrible illegal shit MAGA has pulled was anything more asinine than the Arizona Ninjas looking for Chinese bamboo ballots? That's on you MAGA chucklefucks. Also too, after all that election fraud and criming, the official Ninja tally was +13 for the Dems. Dumbfuck cultists, the whole lot of you weirdos.
DeleteTrump is a winning brand.
DeleteTrump is a good resource for how to navigate multiple bankruptcies, and how to prey on minors.
DeleteOtherwise, he is the least popular president in history.
"Rosen doesn't say their names!"
ReplyDeleteSomerby is mad because Rosen hasn't mentioned him. Narcissists! There's no pleasing them.
Cable news is dead.
Weirdos like Somerby are itching for a civil war so they can dismantle our democracy and replace it with ruling elites that then dictate to us what our best interests are.
ReplyDeleteNo, humans are not hard wired to split into rival tribes. Crack a book sometime, Somerby.
Tribalism is absolutely hard wired in human beings. You should take your own advice and "crack a book."
DeleteI agree with 11:41 that tribalism is part of human beings. But, what's different today is that the "opposing tribe" consists of fellow Americans, rather than foreigners.
DeleteNo, fuckface, you're fucking treasonous bastards Putin turd polishers.
DeleteYou know what day it is today DiChead? Punch a fascist in the face day. Same as any other ending in Y. My folks raised me antifa. What the fuck was wrong with your folks?
DeleteAccording to "books" 11:32 is correct, humans are not hard wired for being "split into rival tribes", 11:41 seems to get it wrong although 11:41 does not directly refute 11:32 and instead says something a bit different. Humans forming tribes is an important aspect in humans surviving and thriving but not in the sense that Somerby means, which is probably why 11:32 specifically said "rival tribes". So 11:32 gets it right, and if 11:41 is refuting 11:32 then 11:41 is simply wrong.
DeleteTribalism means people work together as part of a tribe.
DeleteThat is essentially the opposite of what Somerby means; Somerby is referring to people splitting into rival tribes and humans are not hard wired for that.
DeleteI’m hard-wired to split into rival tribes, but after all I’m a demon.
Delete3:52 Per chance, is your name Talarico???
DeleteSomerby is obviously talking about something akin to a civil war, something we are not hard wired for, he even references The Civil War and Lincoln.
DeleteWhile Paxton cheated on his wife and is getting a divorce, Talarico has a super hot cool girlfriend and it drives Republicans loony because their partners have all transitioned themselves into freaks.
DeleteModern communication technology, especially social media, undermine the Founding Fathers' assumption that citizens can reason together in pursuit of truth.
ReplyDeleteThe algorithms encourage people to remain in ideologically homogeneous.
It makes it harder for people who engage in these technologies to reason.
Today, voters in both parties have the same goals: peace, prosperity, clean air and water, equality, justice, good education, good health, etc. However, the pols we elect have opposite goals. Both groups of pols want power. Only one side can have it.
ReplyDeleteThe power of being an IN is enormous. Fame. Money. The Trump family is making billions. The Biden family made millions. Pelosi and others in Congress used their situation to enrich themselves in the stock market. So, the pols work hard to divide voters, even though voters share the same goals. The pols lie shamelessly.
The media also profits by dividing the populace. We readers eagerly read sources that confirm our prejudices. Media that should take pride in accuracy also twist their reporting. The strange result is that people agree about what the goals are but disagree about what reality is.
Will the nation survive the divisive words and policies of our pols and media? Good question.
Go fuck yourself, dickhead.
DeleteYour Gestapo got another one of those brown invaders yesterday, dickhead. Do you feel safer now?
DeleteKeep in mind, dickhead in Cal, crawled naked thru a Paris sewer to vote 3 times for a fucking felon who is implementing the Project 2025 complete dismantling of our Constitutional democracy and pardoned cop murderers on his first day in office.
DeleteBothsiderism is a fascist tool you fucking fool.
DeleteThe fucking child rapist is finally paying one of his victims. It takes awhile to get justice with this evil fuck, don't it?
DeleteIdiot DiC remember a couple days ago bragging about Toyota moving to TX from Mexico due to Trumps tarriff geniusness? Ha Ha. Everything the orange fat fuck touches goes to hell.
Delete"But the President is right that his tariffs are at work—in destroying U.S. jobs and raising prices. The U.S. has lost some 75,000 manufacturing jobs since January 2025, including 25,900 in motor vehicle and parts production.
The Anderson Economic Group estimates that auto tariffs on Canada and Mexico alone added about $1,600 to the cost of each car made in the U.S. last year. While auto makers absorbed some of the Trump tariff costs, they also passed on a large share to customers.
A March report by Cox Automotive found that tariffs drove a 10.4% increase in the average suggested retail price of a new car. Sticker prices rose by an estimated $5,000 to $8,900 for imported vehicles and about $1,600 to $2,000 for U.S.-made cars. Auto dealers—most of which are small businesses—absorbed about 4.5% of the manufacturer’s price increase."
The Biden FAMILY made millions? Go ahead and supply us with the details. But do not use the testimony of the chief witness for the GOP, a Russian asset who conveniently disappeared when the time came for his appearance on the Hill. Exactly how many millions dis Jill and Joe Biden make?
DeleteThe Republican House committee did a report. It was like 20. Funneled mostly through Hunter and his brother Jim. You can read it and see. And they even have the canceled checks.
Delete20? lol you’re so full of shit it’s coming out your ears
DeleteIt was like 20 million I think was the figure. You can read it yourself online.
DeleteYou can go fu k yourself, what kind of dumb fuck are you? You want me to read something you haven’t linked to? Sure, I’ll get right on it
DeleteMerely google "House report on Biden family corruption" and click the relevant link.
DeleteMerely go fuck yourself
DeleteI thought you wanted to hyperlink to the report.
DeleteThe money was funneled into shell companies. It's nothing to get upset about.
DeleteNo, I wanted you to go fuck yourself
DeleteOh. How would I do that?
Deletehttps://share.google/7yNyO1nwvl38yBbkz
Delete"Voters in both parties have the same goals: peace, prosperity, clean air and water, equality, justice, good education, good health, etc."
DeleteBullshit.
MAGA doesn't want peace, they want Caribbean boat murders and they want Good and Pretti and Araujo to be shot down like dogs. They don't want good health if it comes from vaccines or from an NIH grant and they don't want clean air and water or they wouldn't lsit by while Trump and his billionaire cronies take down environmental regs.
And if they wanted justice they'd be clamoring for the J6 sore-loser-tantrum-throwers Trump pardoned to be put back in jail. But MAGA doesn't raise a peep on any of these issues because they suck.
Here on planet Earth, people who identify with or vote for Donald Trump vary considerably in their views on vaccines, environmental regulation, January 6 defendants, foreign policy, and other issues.
Delete"Maga doesn't want clean water."
Deletelol.
What 4:46 wrote is what it said in a WSJ editorial today.
DeleteGo take a flying fuck, dickhead
DeleteRosen offers no ideas about how to deal with social media. Technology has always posed challenges. Shall we shrug and accept the doom Rosen predicts?
ReplyDelete“Can our form of government, can our nation, "long endure?" “
ReplyDeleteLincoln didn’t just worry. He set about forcing the confederacy back into the nation.
Yes it is hard not to notice that after the brutal Civil War the US continued as a nation for at least another 160 years.
DeleteSocial media may be rough for some but it hardly compares to what was endured during the Civil War. C'mon, Bob.
In fact, in the decades after the Civil War, the US eventually was able to provide society with one of the largest and most significant expansions of wealth and stability in human history following WWII and the New Deal and taxing the rich with a top marginal rate in the 70-90% range - top marginal rate means they are only taxed that rate on income above what already provides them with a life of luxury.
We also experienced the richness of life more than ever via art and literature and music.
Bob is a poor thinker.
I'm quite astonished, actually, that our MSM doesn’t hammer Trump on the fact that he has no white paper detailing his claims of election fraud, something Bob has been howling about for a very long time.
ReplyDeleteAside from the MSM, have any politicians made an effort to demand evidence of Trump’s claims? If not, why? If so, why aren’t they making a concerted effort to compel him to substantiate his claims?
Maybe I’ve missed a case of recent history, and people ARE actually holding Trump’s feet to the fire on this issue, but I’m not aware of it. WTF is going on? Oh, right – Democrats are the opposition. Now it makes sense.
Leroy
Trump has lost numerous court cases over his claims.
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