Hispanics and blacks in the Golden State!

WEDNESDAY, SEPTEMBER 6, 2017

Enrollment in the state's university system:
Are blacks and Hispanics "under-represented" within the nine campuses of the University of California?

In its August 25 front-page report,
the New York Times presented the data for all nine of the system's campuses. Here's the bulk of the brief report which accompanied the voluminous school-by-school data:
ASHKENAS, PARK AND PEARCE: (8/25/17): The number of Hispanic and black freshmen on the University of California campuses declined immediately after California’s affirmative action ban took effect, especially at the most sought-after campuses, said Stephen Handel, associate vice president for undergraduate admissions. The system put the ban in place in 1998.

Even now, both Hispanics and blacks are least represented at Berkeley, the most selective campus. On seven campuses, Hispanics now make up a quarter or more of the freshmen, but that’s still far below their share of the college-age population in the state, which is close to 50 percent.
The Times is describing an obvious case of proportional under-enrollment. According to the Times' more detailed data, Hispanics made up 49 percent of the state's college-age population in 2015, the most recent year for which the Times had data. But Hispanics were only 33 percent of the freshmen enrollment in the university system's nine campuses that year.

A similar "enrollment gap" obtained in the case of blacks. Seven percent of the state's college-age population was black in 2015, but blacks were only three percent of the student enrollment at the university system's nine campuses.

As the Times reported, enrollment shortfalls were most striking at Berkeley and UCLA, the system's most competitive campuses. At UCLA, 24 percent of the freshmen were Hispanic in 2015. At Berkeley, the figure was only 15 percent.

Hispanic enrollmnt was highest at U.C. Merced (58 percent), the only campus where Hispanic enrollment outstripped that group's share of the student-age population. Black enrollment topped out at four percent at three of the system's campuses, including UCLA.

Why were enrollment figures so low for these two groups of kids? On Thursday and Friday, we'll take a look at that question.

For today, we'll only note the lousy job the New York Times did reporting its seminal question:

In 2015, were these groups even more under-represented at these campuses than they had been in the past—more specifically, way back in 1980? As a general matter, that was the central claim made by the New York Times front-page report.

With respect to the Cal university system, there's no real way to answer that question from the data the Times presented. More precisely:

In its typical incompetent way, the Times presented full data for 2015, but not for 1980. For example, as noted above, readers are told that Hispanics were 49 percent of the college-age population that year, but only 33 percent of the freshman enrollment.

But alas! As you can see if you examine the relevant graphics, the Times didn't publish the comparable figures for 1980. For that reason, it's hard to say if the degree of enrollment shortfall has grown since that time.

At any rate, there's no doubt about one basic point; at present, there's a substantial "enrollment gap" for blacks and Hispanics on these state university campuses. Why are blacks and Hispanics "under-represented" at these competitive schools?

Why are blacks and Hispanics "under-represented?" That's an important question. In the next few days, we'll examine the reasons the New York Times supplied in its very brief written report. Then, we'll look at testing data for public school students in the state of California as a whole.

Why do those "enrollment shortfalls" persist? The question is very important. The Times made little attempt at supplying an answer—but then too, the Times never does.

29 comments:

  1. UCLA, UCSD and Cal Berkeley are elite schools despite being public. The CSU (not UC) system is less competitive but high quality, and less expensive. It attracts more minority applicants and such students when accepted are more likely to go there. These schools head the best college lists for minority students every year. Ignoring this to focus only on elite schools makes no sense. Minority students don't attach the same value to schools as Somerby & the NY Times does.

    For decades the only black students at UCLA were athletes. How did Title 9 affect the percents?

    ReplyDelete
  2. I will answer why and see how correct I am. First, that is all that were qualified attend those schools. Second, that was all were qualified and wanted to attend those schools.

    ReplyDelete
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  4. The concept of "ethnically under-represented" is disgusting and racist. It means that colleges are discriminating against Asians and whites -- particularly those whites who tend to excel educationally, such as Mormons and Jews. (BTW if historical discrimination justifies preferences, why shouldn't Asian and Jews.get some sort of boost for historical discrimination against them? Instead, colleges are still discriminating against Asians and Jews.)

    IMHO the government went off the rails when it decided to assign each of us an ethnicity and pretend that this ethnicity is the most important characteristic of an individual.

    I would add that southern colleges discriminated against blacks, but not northern colleges. On the contrary, both my wife's alma mater and mine (U of Chicago and Wellesley) were already making an extra effort to recruit black students in the early 1960's. I presume many other non-southern colleges were doing the same.

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    Replies
    1. Dave the Guitar PlayerSeptember 7, 2017 at 12:49 PM

      David, you are obviously blind. Somehow you are able to navigate your adult life and never see any evidence of racial discrimination. Just because the college you went to made some attempt to recruit black students, you believe that the racial problem on campuses was solved, at least in non-southern colleges. It apparently offends you to be told that today, right now, there are people making decisions about who can attend their university who would "prefer" that only white students apply. We can't know who they are, since they stopped wearing their hoods to work some time ago, and perhaps they don't even think they are racist. They just want what is best for their university, and "we" all know the best are white (or Jewish or Mormon or Asian). Ethnicity is not the *most* important characteristic of an individual, but when you are dealing with ethnic racism, what characteristic would you use? How do you deal with tests that are culturally biased to improve the scores of students with the "right" cultural background? The concept of "ethnically under-represented" is not as disgusting as the persistent discrimination that causes some (most?) of the under-representation. Discrimination is not historical, it is real and it is happening right now all around you. You should be asking, what can we do about it?

      Delete
    2. David belongs to a party that has been systematically and relentlessly working night and day to make it as difficult as possible for blacks to vote. The evidence is pervasive, everywhere you look. Time and time again Democrats are forced to fight in courts the GOP unconstitutional tactics devised to suppress black votes wherever they can.

      Naturally then David sees discrimination against whites and is working diligently on his quest to find the phantom millions of "illegal" voters that exist only in his warped mind.

      Delete
    3. Hi, mm. Just found this in today's news:

      Newly available data is casting doubt on the integrity of the presidential election in New Hampshire in 2016, which Hillary Clinton won by just over 2,700 votes.

      Over 6,000 voters in New Hampshire had used same-day voter registration procedures to register and vote simultaneously for president. The current New Hampshire speaker of the House, Shawn Jasper, sought and obtained data about what happened to these 6,000 "new" New Hampshire voters who showed up on Election Day.

      It seems the overwhelming majority of them can no longer be found in New Hampshire.

      Of those 6,000, only 1,014 have ever obtained New Hampshire driver's licenses. Of the 5,526 voters who never obtained a New Hampshire driver's license, a mere three percent have registered a vehicle in New Hampshire.

      The Public Interest Legal Foundation received information that 70 percent of the same-day registrants used out-of-state photo ID to vote in the 2016 presidential election in New Hampshire and to utilize same-day registration.

      https://pjmedia.com/jchristianadams/2017/09/07/new-data-illegal-voters-may-decided-new-hampshire-2016/

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    4. Get back to me David when you have some proof.

      Meanwhile, in the real world, not Wingnut Land,


      A federal judge in Texas has again thrown out the state's controversial voter ID law, which required voters to show one of several approved forms of photo ID to cast a ballot.

      U.S. District Judge Nelva Gonzales Ramos issued a permanent injunction against the law on Wednesday. In her ruling, the judge wrote that changes made to the law did not "fully ameliorate" practices she said were "enacted with discriminatory intent — knowingly placing additional burdens on a disproportionate number of hispanic and African-American voters."


      http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/08/23/545664409/-federal-judge-permanently-blocks-texas-voter-id-law


      Delete
    5. David, instead of posting bullshit from your right wing nutjob conspiracy sources, you could have taken a moment to check a real news source.

      But no, you like to play your little fucking games.

      Where Were Out-of-State IDs Used to Vote in New Hampshire Last November?

      There are reasons why someone might legitimately register to vote with an out-of-state license – most obviously, they could have moved to the state recently or could be attending college here. (The state makes clear that out-of-state students attending college in New Hampshire are allowed to vote here, as long as they aren’t also voting in another state.)

      Overall, the towns that see the highest rates of out-of-state IDs used at the polls are all home to college campuses: the University of New Hampshire (Durham, with some spillover in Dover and Portsmouth), Dartmouth (Hanover and Lebanon), Keene State University (Keene), Franklin Pierce University (Rindge), Plymouth State University (Plymouth), Saint Anselm University (near the border of Goffstown and Manchester), New England College (Henniker) and Southern New Hampshire University (Hooksett).

      Delete
    6. mm, Well done. That's a pretty good defense.

      Of course, neither side actually checked to see whether each of the individuals was or was not a legal voter. They're both just relying on probabilities.

      Delete
    7. Notice how fuckface David completely ignores the fact that his party is systematically and continuously working to suppress black votes wherever they can.

      Hey shithead, you posted a completely laughable bullshit bunch of speculative nonsense where someone took two isolated data points and tried to imply something nefarious or illegal happened. I posted an article that clearly showed that most of these same day vote came from college towns where out-of-state students are permitted to vote per NH state law. You post bullshit insinuations.

      Delete
    8. Yes, mm, I published speculations and you responded with speculations. I would like to see a real investigation of the magnitude of illegal voting, based on actual facts.

      Delete
    9. You're a dishonest piece of shit Comrade DinC. I did not post speculations. I posted the full context of the story, the part you dishonestly left out. There is nothing suspicious or unusual about same day registration of out of state voters. You posted the slanted dishonest article from a wingnut source that was clearly intended to suggest something nefarious about it without any proof whatsoever.


      ************
      "Using cherry-picked data in order to support a false claim is dangerous and irresponsible. Today's release of information by Speaker Jasper's office fans the flames of misinformation in order to further suppress our citizens' right to vote," Senate Democratic Leader Jeff Woodburn said in a written statement. "The fact of the matter is that there is no requirement to obtain a NH driver's license or register your car in order to exercise your constitutionally-protected right to vote. Even the restrictive Senate Bill 3 passed by Republicans earlier this year does not force a voter to obtain a NH license or register their car in New Hampshire.” "

      Democratic Party Chairman Ray Buckley called voter fraud allegations a "time-honored New Hampshire Republican tradition."

      "These out of state licenses can easily be accounted for by college students who have every right to vote in the state," he said.
      ***************


      Delete
    10. "These out of state licenses can easily be accounted for by college students who have every right to vote in the state," he said.

      "Can easily be" = speculation. Nobody on either side actually checked to see whether any of these 6000 votes were improper.

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    11. Oops. The same Conservatives who "speculate" that there might have been voter fraud in NH, have access to the info to prove whether or not their speculation tis true, but they still won't follow through. I wonder why?

      Just kidding. I don't really wonder why. That was just a rhetorical device. like most sentient people, I know Conservatives are vote suppressing, anti-democratic dirtbags, who shouldn't be allowed anywhere near the levers of governmental power.

      Delete
    12. You're the one making the allegation, asshole. You and Kris Kobach and the GOP NH House Speaker. I suggest you guys get busy checking it out. Stupid motherfucker. Check out your dishonest Kris Kobach who is actually appointed by the abomination you voted for to vice chair of the election integrity commission.

      Kris Kobach’s leap of logic on voter fraud in New Hampshire should be disqualifying

      The state of New Hampshire has the personal information of these individuals to the point that they know if and when they registered cars. If the Republican legislature and governor would like to dig deeper and determine if any of those 5,000-plus people committed fraud, they certainly can. But since this claim has been made repeatedly, we already have any number of examples of people in the state saying that they’ve seen no evidence of fraud having occurred.

      Kobach’s essay would have been troubling enough had it only run with the idea that the 2016 results were uncertain because 5,000 voters voted with out-of-state licenses. But there’s that phrase with which he kicked off his essay: “Now there’s proof.” Now, he wrote, there’s proof “that out-of-staters take advantage of New Hampshire’s same-day registration and head to the Granite State to cast fraudulent votes” — the numbers cited above. They are to proof what Jackson Pollock is to portraits: If you really want to see a face, you’ll see it.


      Kobach is the vice-chairman of the Presidential Advisory Commission on Election Integrity, working with the vice president of the United States. He is helping to lead a federal investigation into the integrity of the voting system — and he cites college kids at Dartmouth as “proof” that Hillary Clinton actually lost the state. His commission, in fact, could ask New Hampshire for the data to investigate these 5,000 cases itself, at which point Kobach could inform the public about whether or not fraud had been proven. Instead he riffed on a Washington Times article.



      Delete
  5. Dave -- There is objective evidence of discrimination in favor of blacks and Hispanics and against Asians in college admissions. Asian Americans are penalized by 50 points of SAT score — in other words, they had to do that much better to win admission. African Americans received a “bonus” of 230 points Hispanics received a bonus of 185 points. See http://www.latimes.com/local/california/la-me-adv-asian-race-tutoring-20150222-story.html

    You assert that, "today, right now, there are people making decisions about who can attend their university who would 'prefer' that only white students apply." But, what is the evidence for this assertion?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Message to Dave the Guitar Player - as a complainer that liberals would rather insult Trumpheads than persuade them with facts and logic, here's your chance.

      It's been nearly a day. Put your money where your mouth is.

      Delete
    2. Interesting link, DinC, but I wanted to see a question answered that was never asked. Why are these bonuses and penalizations part of the equation?

      Before you say it doesn’t matter, it’s racism, I want to say that it may. What sort of evaluation matrix is involved in making such determinations, and why was it created? Unfortunately, the link to the Princeton University study took me to a study about friendliness genes in wolves. Perfect!

      Check out this link. (Apologies to some friends who have given me the tools to actually post a LINK rather than its entire address).

      https://www.insidehighered.com/admissions/article/2017/08/07/look-data-and-arguments-about-asian-americans-and-admissions-elite

      “Do Colleges Consider Race in Admissions?”

      “Yes, but only some of them do so. Much discussion about affirmative action suggests that nearly all colleges consider race in admissions. Most don't.

      “More than two-thirds of colleges reported to the National Association for College Admission Counseling that the race and ethnicity of applicants has "no influence" on admissions decisions, and only 3.4 percent said that it has "considerable influence." Many critics of affirmative action argue that colleges don't tell the truth about their practices. In this case, however, a key fact is that the vast majority of colleges are not competitive in admissions and admit a majority of those who apply. (The elite private and public institutions one reads about in discussions of affirmative action are in fact atypical of higher education.)”

      I’ll give you credit DinC, you didn’t link to a looney-tunes site, but even this one had something to be desired in answer to the question of racist admissions protocols.

      Leroy

      Delete
  6. Why are blacks and Hispanics "under-represented?" That's an important question.

    With a simple answer: on average, those groups have lower IQs than Europeans or Asians.

    It's no coincidence that US "chocolate cities" such as Detroit, Baltimore or New Orleans decline to the point where they resemble African cities such as Lagos.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. If you define "IQ" to be whatever is measured by IQ tests, then it's important to recognize that the lower average black IQ does NOT mean that there's a genetic difference. IQ is affected by lots of environmental factors. The difference could well be entirely cultural. This sad article may give a clue as to the cause.

      The parents of an academically stellar African-American student are suing a South Carolina school district alleging school officials did not prevent continued verbal and physical abuse of their daughter from … other black students.

      Students at Richland School District One’s Hand Middle School “called (the girl) racial slurs like ‘Oreo,’ ‘white girl,’ ‘wannabe white girl’ … and generally maligned her for ‘acting white,’”


      https://pjmedia.com/trending/2017/09/06/black-parents-sue-school-claim-bullies-abuse-daughter-acting-white/

      Delete
    2. "It's no coincidence that US "chocolate cities" such as Detroit, Baltimore or New Orleans decline to the point where they resemble African cities such as Lagos."

      How did you get to be so 'economically anxious", Anonymous at 1;24 PM?

      Delete
    3. @7:09 PM - his/her/its Russian troll farm went tits up and now he/she/it is just a freelancing kulak troll.

      Delete
    4. More tripe from Pajamas Media. Are you that stupid to believe that you're being persuasive with this shit?

      Delete
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  9. If colleges didn't impose quotas and discriminate, they would be 75% female because women do better academically. Does that mean women have higher IQs? Should men be given affirmative action?

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