MONDAY, JUNE 19, 2023
Back in the saddle again: On this glorious Juneteenth Day, the New York Times is at it again:
LETTERS / Mississippi’s Many Education Lessons
Inevitably, three readers fumble and flail.
Incompetence is in the saddle, as always. At the highest end of this discourse, the incompetence (along with the attendant elite indifference) pretty much never ends.
Storyline is in the saddle. Storyline rides humankind.
Shun Republicans.
ReplyDeleteShun Somerby.
Delete"Inevitably, three readers fumble and flail.
ReplyDeleteIncompetence is in the saddle, as always. At the highest end of this discourse, the incompetence (along with the attendant elite indifference) pretty much never ends."
So, now "elite indifference" is exemplified by reader letters?
One letter writer says:
ReplyDelete"Mr. Kristof’s sole focus on test scores is like a swim coach’s obsession with improved times but no concern for the well-being of the youngsters swimming in toxic water. We should be concerned with the children’s overall well-being, not just their test scores. Where is the outrage over child poverty?"
Somerby calls this incompetence. And then he claims indifference, while displaying Kristof's laser-focus on scores. Somerby himself is behaving like the so-called elites he chastises, unconcerned with the whole child or the poverty levels. Determined only to use NAEP numbers to call his elites names.
"I love the way that red states refuse to fund public programs, but they go around with a tin cup, asking others to contribute. Public education should be funded by the public that benefits, and Republican states should raise taxes so that the rest of us aren’t funding their initiatives.
ReplyDeleteBarbara Barran
Brooklyn"
Here we have a person declining to pay taxes for improving public education, but where is the evidence she herself is elite, or represents any elites? To my ear, she sounds like most Republicans.
To my ear…she sounds like a Blue State Democrat complaining that her side is picking up the tab for people who need the most public help, but are the least willing to ante up.
DeleteShe says her complaint is about red states who refuse to fund public programs, not "her side" if she is a Blue State Democrat. She is complaining about Reublican states who should be raising taxes, not seeking donations.
DeleteBut notice that Somerby was complaining about uncaring elites and incompetence. How does this letter exemplify any elite or any incompetence?
And I stand by my claim that this woman, whether Democrat or not, is saying she doesn't want to pay for anyone's education, just like the Republicans in red states who she complains about. And if everyone declines to pay for other people's education, then we have a society that is shunning responsibility for educating children and undermining the education needed to function competently as a democracy.
There is some evidence the Mississippi did increase its public funding for reading instruction:
"In Mississippi, the Legislature continues to annually appropriate money to reimburse school districts for screeners, fund professional development in the science of reading and instructional best practices, and fund literacy coaches among other supports. "
"The Legislature has invested $15-million annually in reading coaches to improve literacy instruction in low performing schools and in statewide literacy training for teachers in kindergarten through grade three, both of which have been instrumental in improving reading scores."
https://msparentscampaign.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/05/Fast_Facts_Ed_2023.pdf
"State funding for Mississippi schools is determined by the Mississippi Adequate Education Program (MAEP), passed into law in 1997. Learn more: www.tpcref.org/mississippi-adequate-education-program-maep/.
The legislature has voted to comply with this law and fully fund the MAEP formula only four times since 1997. During the recession, in fiscal years 2009 and 2010, school budgets were reduced mid-year, so schools have only received full funding twice, in fiscal years 2004 and 2008. For the 2022-2023 school year, the MAEP was underfunded by $279-million statewide. Since it was last fully funded in 2008, schools have been shorted $3.3-billion.
In the 2023 Legislative Session, with an extra $1-billion in recurring revenue available to spend, legislators chose to underfund public schools by $161-million.
Mississippi ranks 50th in the nation in per capita income (US Bureau of Economic Analysis, 2022). Nearly 28% of Mississippi children live in poverty, and 14% of Mississippi children live in extreme poverty (Annie E. Casey Foundation/Kids Count, 2022). Research has shown consistently that at least 40% more in resources is required to bring children in poverty to the same level of achievement as children in non-poverty homes. Mississippi’s own experience shows that adequate school funding is correlated with achievement. Following full funding of the MAEP in 2008 and near-full funding in 2009, Mississippi students had the highest gains in fourth grade reading in the nation. Additionally, significant investments in literacy, consistently applied since Fiscal Year 2014, have resulted in an acceleration in the reading proficiency of Mississippi students as measured by NAEP."
I love a sighting of such a Democrat because it’s pretty obvious they exist largely in Cecelia’s head.
DeleteAnonymouse 10:03am, the article and letters from readers are behind a firewall. Do you know that the letter you cited is one of the three Somerby referenced?
DeleteYou label, Barbara Barran, as being a Republican because she says,“Republican states should raise taxes so that the rest of us aren’t funding their initiatives.”
That’s an interesting take on things.
Anonymouse 10:43am, oh, that’s choice.
DeleteDemocrats from blue states bemoan the subsidizing of red states all the time.
They certainly have done that here and will again the next time it counted a blog.
In any local election, Democrats vote more strongly in favor of school bonds than Republicans. Democrats in state legislatures are more supportive of school funding than Republicans.
DeleteWhen Democrats complain about having to subsidize red states, it isn't because Democrats do not value those programs or think people do not deserve the support (things Republicans think), but because Republicans are not doing their share to contribute to the common good. For example, all businesses in a state benefit from a more educated workforce, but Republicans won't pay to produce educated workers -- in that sense, they freeload off the Democrats while complaining about taxes and using them as a political issue.
You do not need to mansplain Democratic attitudes to Democrats, Cecelia.
"To my ear…she sounds like a Blue State Democrat complaining that her side is picking up the tab for people who need the most public help, but are the least willing to ante up."
DeleteSchools are mostly funded locally. Mississippi is not a Blue State. Why would someone in another state be complaining about Republicans not picking up their share of MS funding, which was voted by the state legislature and thus included all in the state who pay taxes. Taxes are very low (relatively speaking) in MS:
"Mississippi has a flat 5.00 percent individual income tax. Mississippi also has a 4.00 to 5.00 percent corporate income tax rate. Mississippi has a 7.00 percent state sales tax rate, a max local sales tax rate of 1.00 percent, and an average combined state and local sales tax rate of 7.07 percent."
Republicans are the ones who move to other states to avoid paying state taxes:
"Democrats thinking about moving to another state are about twice as likely to consider blue states than red or swing states — and Republicans' preference for red states over the alternatives is even more pronounced"
"38% of Republicans and 23% of Democrats said tax-related concerns were driving their thoughts about wanting to move"
https://www.axios.com/2022/08/08/two-americas-poll-red-blue-states
So this isn't just a belief among Democrats, but there are stats to prove this is happening, that Republicans move to shirk their tax responsibilities.
Apparently over 70% of our nation’s gdp is from blue tribe counties.
DeleteOof.
Anonymouse 11:27pm, I haven’t read where anyone here has accused Democrats in blue states of not wishing to fund the programs and the reforms that they seek.
DeleteOn the contrary. I’ve said that Barbara Barren (the letter writer) voiced a common complaint and frustration felt by Democrats, she wants more for these red state kids than their parents and neighbors (who want lower taxes) wish for them,
That sentiment has been seen here a gazillion times. That’s why it’s a surprise to now see it called selfishness. That the people who make that familiar complaint of wanting red states to step up are now really Republicans.
I’m not being unfair to Democrats or misrepresenting them, you are. You’re labeling a large cohort of your party as being stealth Republicans for voicing frustration that is not entirely unreasonable. You’re doing that in order to counter a point that Somerby has not made.
Anonymouse 11:37am, how does any of that differ with what I stated about the complaints that blue states Democrats make about red state Republicans?
DeleteIt’s not a complaint nor a frustration; it’s pointing out the hypocrisy of right wingers and their false righteousness while engaging in oppression, it’s a way to demonstrate that right wingers have no ideology, no concern beyond “owning the libs”.
DeleteThe letter writer suggests the financial burden should fall on those that benefit, but this notion is antithetical to leftism. The burden should fall on those with the means and ability to carry the burden.
Always bear this in mind: Republicans are evil.
DeleteAnonymouse 3:36pm, no, the letter writer thinks that red state citizens ought to pay the same tax rates as in blue states. For that she’s been labeled a stealth Republican.
DeleteRepublicans, a subset of right wingers, are wounded lost souls; they are a symptom of a warped society.
DeleteFew people in the history of human civilization have been as coddled and catered to as Republicans.
A healthy and happy society will produce no Republicans, their time (of existing) will come.
Look, I’m not going to be so crass as to pull the “reading comprehension” card, but I quote the letter writer:
Delete“Public education should be funded by the public that benefits”
Anonymouse 3:53pm, you conveniently left off the rest of the sentence- “…and Republican states should raise taxes so that the rest of us aren’t funding their initiatives.”
DeleteHow could blue states NOT contribute taxes to our federal government which provides some funds to public education?
How would Barbara Barren think that could ever stop?
She knows better. She is championing a plan whereby red states raise taxes and carry more of their load in the way that blue states carry theirs.
Children benefit but it seems unfair to tax them.
DeleteThe letter writer is championing a notion that those that benefit should be the ones funding a public good, this is not a notion of paying a fair share according to one’s means and ability.
DeleteThis is bad policy, antithetical to leftism, and aligns more with right wingers.
There are finer points to be made about the differences between:
“raise taxes so that the rest of us aren’t funding their initiatives”
“red state citizens ought to pay the same tax rates as in blue states”
and
“The burden should fall on those with the means and ability to carry the burden”
But with an interlocutor bent on being obtuse, there is little point.
Anonymouse 6:37pm, there’s a not-so-fine point to be made that when red state citizens call for lower taxes and limited federal programs, they would be the most negatively affected by that scenario. That is not a predicament that has gone unnoticed and uncommented upon by blue state liberals who would take up the slack. This political argument traditionally been an ongoing debate between the parties.
DeleteIf you want to call those Dems stealth Republicans for noticing…have at it.
However, this take, is to date, the most amusing preemptive strike against an anticipated, yet-unwritten,TDH blog.
I can only hope that Bob completely agrees with you on this. THAT certainly would serve you right.
Playing gotcha instead of discussing substantive things?
DeleteToday Somerby says someone has fumbled and failed and he links to several letters about education in Mississippi, a state he cannot seem to let go of, because they had the nerve to increase their reading scores on the 4th grade NAEP. But then he doesn't tell us who are the elites and he doesn't pinpoint any incompetence in anyone and he goes off to his day's activities without telling us what anyone did wrong, leaving the impression that everyone is wrong among those letter writers.
ReplyDeleteOr maybe the kids themselves are the wrong ones, for having done better in reading? This is an ugly smear and run tactic that Somerby excuses with his health appts, but did he really have to criticize anyone before his real essay later in the day? Is it fair to blame everyone (which is the default if you don't say who you are targeting)? And is it fair to do that without any evidence or even argument at all?
This is just plain wrong and Somerby should know better than to do this. And to call anyone uncaring when these letter writers took the time to express their concern by writing a letter, is especially unfair. Or does the NY Times demonstrate its lack of caring by publishing them? Wrong, wrong, wrong, Somerby.
Phonics.
ReplyDeleteNo one here is talking about phonics. I might claim that books are needed to help children become readers. If I repeated that every day, in a single word, as you do, what would I be contributing to any discussion?
DeleteBooks.
I’ll start reading books when one is published that is not poorly written.
DeleteSpoken like an illiterate person posturing so that no one will know he cannot read.
DeleteShhhh, let’s keep that just between us.
DeleteInsight like that surely was gleaned from a book, no doubt.
No, I read an article once about why Denny's puts pictures of all of its food in the menu, so that those who cannot read can just point to what they want to eat.
DeleteJibberish, ballyhoo!
DeleteUsing big words does not prove you can read them. Siri takes dictation.
DeleteIn English word order, there is a subect, a verb and an object or adverb. Someone did something. That is the basis for a story. People use language this way because they think that way. When they want to tell someone else what happened, they organize the information in a narrative form, in chronological order, specifying causality and what happened, the outcome. At the end of the information, you state a conclusion and say "the end."
ReplyDeleteSomerby wants to fight this, present this as something evil or wrong that people do, but he is fighting an uphill battle because this is how our minds work. It isn't evil, it isn't wrong, it isn't incompetent. It is functional and the expectation of this format, when thwarted, leaves us unsatisfied, as when there are flashbacks in a story, or a jumbled chronology. Then people misunderstand and get frustrated and don't want to expend mental effort to straighten out in their minds what happened.
Narrative is not the enemy.
Sometimes an adverb precedes the subject, and it often precedes the verb.
DeleteYes, but Chomsky argues in his tranformational grammar that such different structures are translated back into a single universal form in people's minds when reading, allowing people to parse meaning. I am not saying that the order I gave as an example is the universal one -- don't remember. My point is just that people expect info in a certain structure that corresponds to narrative, something that Somerby keeps insisting is imposed by journalists and thus bad -- the negative tone is obvious in these sentences:
Delete"Storyline is in the saddle. Storyline rides humankind."
This is well studied by linguists. See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transformational_grammar
My point is that storyline is expected by people in their communications, which would be confusing, annoying or less comprehensible without it. Somerby might as well be telling journalists they cannot use words.
Chomsky has moved on.
DeleteSemantic structures are hierarchical, not linear.
Syntactic, not semantic.
DeleteThere’s likely legitimate criticism to storytelling, but this is not something Somerby engages in seriously; he just uses the aesthetic of it as a weapon to bludgeon those not on the right.
DeleteStorytelling, more often than not, is used to distract and manipulate in a way that maintains societal power imbalances.
That cannot be true when nearly all expressions consist of storytelling regardless of purpose.
DeleteAssembly instructions to scientific research papers to advertising, it’s all storytelling!
DeleteI see.
Yes, even philosophy.
DeleteAssembly instructions, there is an assumption the steps are presented in the order in which they are to be performed, starting with the parts as they come out of the box and ending with the assembled unit. That is narrative structure.
DeleteResearch papers start with the motivating question and theoretical perspective, review what has previously been done (lit review), describe what the rationale is for the current expt, descibe the methods used to collect data, descibe the data analysis, describe what the data says about the hypothesis, critiques possible flaws and any alternative explanations for the results, states conclusions and places them back into the context of the literature and the original research question. The literature and the study are described in chronological order. Cause and effect appear with cause first and effect second. That is narrative structure and researchers are trained to follow it.
DeleteIn advertising, people have a vexing problem. They tried other approaches that didn’t work. Then they tried the advertised product and it benefitted them. Now they are happy. Appeal to viewer — if you try it, it will help you too. Insert gimmicks to attract attention. Narrative structure again.
DeleteBy “Storyline” I think Bob means a dogmatic view that repeats the same thing with no attention to contradicting facts. Or ad we might call it “The Daily Howler.”
ReplyDeleteI am unclear about which three letters Bob is criticizing or why. My guess, based on prior posts, is that he wanted the letters to mention the possibility that Mississippi’s improvement was fraudulent.
ReplyDeleteHis post would have been more useful is he had told us whether there fraud or not, in his judgment. And, if he had told us what specific changes led to the improvement.
D in C
Here are the 3 letters, since Somerby tells us nothing about them:
Delete"Re “Mississippi Is Offering Lessons for America on Education,” by Nicholas Kristof (column, “How America Heals” series, June 1):
Mississippi schools prove that all the reasons for the failure of children to learn how to read and excel have been excuses. Critics will no doubt claim that its success is an aberration, but the evidence is clear. The only question now is whether its approach is scalable.
Walt Gardner
Los Angeles
The writer taught for 28 years in the Los Angeles Unified School District and was a lecturer in the U.C.L.A. Graduate School of Education."
Letter 2:
Delete"To the Editor:
“Thank God for Mississippi” is both the beginning and the exuberant ending of Nicholas Kristof’s article. It starts with the imagined sardonic invocation of those four words by Arkansas and Alabama (ranked, respectively, sixth and eighth among all states in child poverty) because even with their rankings, they could trust that Mississippi would score below them. Ah, the glee of not placing last!
Poverty is out as an excuse, a Harvard economist and education expert declares in the middle of the ebullient piece, which ends with a heartfelt “Thank God for Mississippi!” from Mr. Kristof because the state raised test scores while spending less on education than other states.
Thank God for Mississippi ranking No. 1 in child poverty (28 percent)? Thank God for 43 percent of its Black and Hispanic children living in poverty? Really? I cannot and will not thank God for Mississippi allowing students to grow up in poverty.
As a teacher for 30 years, including 17 in a low-income, minority school, I was interested in learning how Mississippi raised test scores. Yes, poor students can learn, but Mr. Kristof dismisses the burdens of poverty. Conditions in Jackson, Miss., resemble those in a developing nation. It lacks clean water and students cannot drink from school water fountains.
Mr. Kristof’s sole focus on test scores is like a swim coach’s obsession with improved times but no concern for the well-being of the youngsters swimming in toxic water. We should be concerned with the children’s overall well-being, not just their test scores. Where is the outrage over child poverty?
Katherine Murphy
Falls Church, Va."
Letter 3:
DeleteTo the Editor:
Regarding the recent success story about teaching reading to low-income children in Mississippi, imagine what their achievement could look like if the same strong coaching and support were given during the first three years of life, when brain growth and development are at their peak.
Mary Meland
Minneapolis
The writer is a retired pediatrician and a member of the advocacy group Doctors for Early Childhood"
To be fair, regardless of the intent, Walt’s letter is utter nonsense.
DeleteTo be fair, Walt has a lot more teaching experience than you or Somerby, and a lot more exposure to the literature in education. I would be more inclined to believe him if he called you and Somerby's remarks utter nonsense, especially since you provide absolutely no rebuttal or evidence, and neither does Somerby.
DeleteThere is a lot of evidence that indicates poverty, as one example, is a valid “excuse” for low reading scores. Learning disabilities is another, etc.
DeleteThe excuse refers not to the scores but to attempting to address deficits and obstacles with trained reading specialists in order to raise scores for kids with such problems. The MS score increases suggest it is possible and should be attempted.
DeleteLetter 4 (raising the question of which 3 Somerby is concerned with, since there are more than 3 in the NY Times:
ReplyDelete"To the Editor:
Nicholas Kristof’s article on education in Mississippi contains good news, but the premise is highly misleading. The state, as usual, didn’t invest two cents in improving education; Jim Barksdale donated $100 million. Now Mississippi can brag about its educational progress, without increasing taxation or its investment in education.
I love the way that red states refuse to fund public programs, but they go around with a tin cup, asking others to contribute. Public education should be funded by the public that benefits, and Republican states should raise taxes so that the rest of us aren’t funding their initiatives.
Barbara Barran
Brooklyn"
The rest of the letters are not about MS or schools.
Kristof is a neoliberal elitist who thought he could carpetbag his way to governor in Oregon, because he happens to own a vineyard there, and because he feels strongly that their progressiveness needs to be reined in.
ReplyDeleteWhat a guy!
Here is something Somerby could discuss but won't:
ReplyDelete"GOP Targets Researchers Who Study Disinformation
June 19, 2023 at 10:46 am EDT By Taegan Goddard
“On Capitol Hill and in the courts, Republican lawmakers and activists are mounting a sweeping legal campaign against universities, think tanks and private companies that study the spread of disinformation, accusing them of colluding with the government to suppress conservative speech online,” the New York Times reports.
“The effort has encumbered its targets with expansive requests for information and, in some cases, subpoenas — demanding notes, emails and other information related to social media companies and the government dating back to 2015. Complying has consumed time and resources and already affected the groups’ ability to do research and raise money.”
Somerby has said nothing to mark Juneteenth, except that it is a nice day. So here is story from CNN via Digby's blog:
ReplyDelete"A Juneteenth tale from CNN:
Temple “Tempie” Cummins stoically stares at the camera with her arms folded in her lap, sitting stiffly in a chair in her dusty, barren backyard with her weather-beaten wooden shack behind her. Her dark, creased face reflects years of poverty and worry.
The faded black and white image of Cummins from 1937 was snapped by a historian who stopped by her home in Jasper, Texas, to ask her about her childhood during slavery. Cummins, who did not know her exact age, shared stories of uninterrupted woe until she recounted how she and her mother discovered that they had been freed.
She said her mother, a cook for their former slave owner’s family, liked to hide in the chimney corner to eavesdrop on dinner conversations. One day in 1865, she overheard her owner say that slavery had ended, but he wasn’t going to let his slaves know until they harvested “another crop or two.”
“When mother heard that she say she slip out the chimney corner and crack her heels together four times and shouts, ‘I’s free, I’s free,’ ” Cummins told the historian, who recorded her story for a New Deal writers’ project that collected the narratives of the formerly enslaved during the Great Depression. “Then she runs to the field, ‘gainst marster’s will and tol’ all the other slaves and they quit work.”
He failed another one of your purity tests and didn't mention Juneteenth in the proper way? Therefore he's not a true liberal like digby?
DeleteYou're a despicable race-baiting scumbag.
He's not any kind of liberal. He mocked Juneteenth by ignoring it, showing us it is just another day for him. And yes, Digby showed what someone who cares about civil rights might say, using an excerpt from one of the cable news services that Somerby criticizes. Somerby showed what a bigot does to thumb his nose at a federal holiday that commemorates the end of slavery everywhere in our nation -- an act that should have happened much sooner than it did.
DeleteSo, now it is race-baiting to celebrate an official US holiday? Only to racists and white supremacists. Somerby wrote what he did on purpose and he isn't fooling anyone.
Idk why but 6:14’s extreme hostility over this matter makes me giggle.
DeleteJuneteenth has been a thing for a long time and now it is a federal holiday, whether Somerby approves or not. From Yastreblansky, another liberal:
ReplyDelete"Happy Juneteenth! And if anybody tells you that's not a real thing, please inform them that it's been a paid state holiday in Texas since 1980, and celebrated there much longer than that, ever since the very first anniversary in 1866 of the day Major General Gordon Granger arrived with the Union army in Galveston, 19 June 1865, to tell the state's population and most particularly its 250,000 enslaved persons, in the words of General Order no. 3,
The people of Texas are informed that, in accordance with a proclamation from the Executive of the United States, all slaves are free. This involves an absolute equality of personal rights and rights of property between former masters and slaves, and the connection heretofore existing between them becomes that between employer and hired labor. The freed are advised to remain at their present homes, and work for wages.
Because they hadn't officially been informed earlier, though all the enslaved persons in Confederate-held territory had in fact been freed in the Emancipation Proclamation of September 1862; it couldn't be implemented, obviously, until the Union had won the war. (And slavery remained legal in Maryland, and parts of Virginia and Louisiana that the Union already held in 1862, because the Proclamation was in principle a military move against the rebels, intended to encourage their slaves to throw off their chains and hurt the Confederate war effort, not an attempt at abolition.)
A fixture everywhere in the African American community in the South by the end of the 19th century, and going northward with the Great Migration in the 20th, it has become an observed holiday in all sorts of states and municipalities (can't give an exhaustive list and I'm finding some contradictory or flat-out wrong assertions at Wikipedia, I'm sorry to say), and recognized by Congress in a bipartisan bill of 1997, and by presidents beginning with the Bush administration with a proclamation in 2002—of course Trump chose to celebrate it in 2020 with a rally in Tulsa, Oklahoma, site of the 1921 race massacre that destroyed the city's "Black Wall Street" district. It was a very good idea to make it a national holiday at last."
I still say “phonics”.
ReplyDeleteAnd I say, “Phonics.”
DeleteNo, it's fonniks.
DeleteHere is another example of media analysis targeting the NY Times. This is what Somerby might have written if he were still relevant and actually a liberal:
ReplyDeletehttps://www.dailykos.com/stories/2023/6/18/2176177/-The-New-York-Times-makes-an-easy-target-but-this-is-absolutely-appalling