WEDNESDAY, SEPTEMBER 27, 2023
Fox & Friends exults: Dumbness can be bottled up. Dumbness can be held at bay, if only for a time.
That said, the unfortunate trait remains undefeated. Consider the latest "biting incident," as reported by NBC's Kelly O'Donnell:
O'DONNELL (9/26/23): President Joe Biden's dog Commander was involved in another biting incident this week, a Secret Service spokesman said.
Commander, a 2-year-old German shepherd, bit a Secret Service Uniformed Division police officer who was working at the White House on Monday night, the spokesman said, adding that the female officer was treated by the White House Medical Office.
The bite appears to be the 11th reported nipping incident involving Commander since October.
[...]
Commander's lengthy biting history was made public in July, when the conservative group Judicial Watch released records obtained through litigation that identified 10 biting incidents of varying severity from October to January.
As a courtesy, we've skipped the semi-embarrassing statement by Elizabeth Alexander, a spokesperson for first lady Jill Biden.
That statement went like this: "As we’ve noted before, the White House can be a stressful environment for family pets, and the First Family continues to work on ways to help Commander handle the often unpredictable nature of the White House grounds."
We've skipped that embarrassing statement. "The President and First Lady are incredibly grateful to the Secret Service and Executive Residence staff for all they do to keep them, their family, and the country safe," the spokesperson also said.
The Secret Service keeps the country safe, but who guarantees the safety of them? Such philosophical questions have been widespread in the wake of this latest "reported nipping incident."
Inevitably, we learned about this nipping incident from some of our cable news friends. We refer to the four co-hosts of Fox & Friends, who spent a large chunk of time this morning discussing this latest event.
Friends don't let friends watch Fox & Friends, an ancient proverb teaches. This morning, we learned of this latest dog-bite event as we skated between the offerings on two different "cable news" programs.
At any rate, our various friends on Fox & Friends discussed this event, at substantial length, at the start of the 7 o'clock hour. They then moved on to a brain-damaged discussion of Taylor Swift's latest desperate search for nationwide public attention.
So it went among the friends! Earlier, they'd opened their show with a detailed discussion of the latest event in which President Biden is said to have "nearly stumbled" as he left Air Force One.
So it went on Fox at the start of this morning's show! Over on Morning Joe, a different collection of cable news friends were discussing the fact that "a New York judge ruled on Tuesday that Donald J. Trump persistently committed fraud by inflating the value of his assets, and stripped the former president of control over some of his signature New York properties."
It was the start of the 6 o'clock hour. While one group of friends was discussing that judicial finding, the other group was discussing the current president's "near-slip," along with a reportedly elaborate new plan to keep him from falling in public again.
More than twenty years ago, we became the first observer to say that Fox & Friends was the dumbest TV news program of all time.
Little has changed since then. Even so, the dumbness to which we referred back then is widely distributed today—and it's destined to win again.
Our own blue cable is bad enough; red cable goes off the charts. Then too, might the largest question concern the apparent dumbness involved in the handling of Commander? Who in the world sits around and stares into air as their German shepherd behaves in the manner described?
Fox & Friends is astoundingly dumb. In our view, blue cable isn't sufficiently better.
Also, the Bidens can't seem to attend to their dog! And then, there's the topic we spoke about yesterday—the way we ourselves, in our own blue tribe, misdescribe the actual contents of Florida's Stop W.O.K.E. Act.
On balance, the Florida law strikes us as possibly somewhat dumb. Our own tribe's conduct concerning that law strikes us as dumber still.
Dumbness can be held at bay for a time. In the end, though, the widely derided human trait has defeated all previous empires.
The tale of the tape: For the record, there may be a bit of uncertainty concerning Commander's precise nip count. To wit:
When the New York Times reported this latest incident in this morning's print editions, Michael Shear reported the headcount in the following way:
SHEAR: Internal emails obtained by a conservative watchdog group and released to the public this summer documented 10 instances of “aggressive behavior” by the president’s pets.
In one of those episodes, an agent was left “shaken,” according to the emails, when he felt the need to hoist up the chair he was sitting on to use as a shield when Commander began barking at him from the top of a White House staircase.
"By the president's pets!" That suggests the possibility that Commander wasn't responsible for all of those previous ten incidents. Indeed, as Shear begins his report, he charges Commander with only "several" of the known events:
SHEAR (9/27/23): President Biden’s dog Commander bit a member of the Secret Service at the White House on Monday evening, the latest in a series of episodes in which one of the Biden family’s pets has bitten people since the president took office in January 2021.
[...].
Commander, a 2-year-old German shepherd, has bitten several members of the Secret Service since arriving at the White House in 2021, including biting one officer on the arm and thigh badly enough that the officer was sent to the hospital.
According to Shear, Commander has sent at least one officer to the hospital. Still, Shear isn't willing to charge all eleven documented incidents to this one particular pet.
The documentation may be hazy. That may explain why O'Donnell employed the term "appears" in her report for NBC News.
Who lets this sort of thing persist? Fox & Friends exulted today, about this and about the "near-slip!" It's getting harder and harder to watch what our defeated nation still refers to as "news."
"On balance, the Florida law strikes us as possibly somewhat dumb."
ReplyDeleteEither I have missed something subtle in the past eleventy columns or this is something of a new concession.
Dang it. I hit publish too quickly. This is me.
ReplyDeleteIt's hard to evaluate the Florida law, because we don't really know how much it's needed. Do some teachers teach that white students should be embarrassed because of slavery? Do some teachers teachers teach that black students should be embarrassed because of the high black crime rate? If those things are happening, then the law is needed. If they're not happening, then the law is superfluous.
ReplyDeletePlay the game, Find the razor blade burried in the polite post by DiC.
DeleteSuppose both of your hypotheticals were true and students complained. Do you think their complaints would be received with equal concern? Certainly not on Fox News and probably not in the halls of Tallahassee.
DeleteIn any event, we don't generally find laws necessary to address imaginary problems--which is what it appears has happened in Florida.
Problem is not the laws wording but application. Whole segments of our shared often horrible history will need to be dumped as it could offend someone somewhere. Grow up and accept that historical bad truths happen snowflakes.
DeleteThere are far more white criminals than black ones in actual numbers. Strictly speaking, a statistician should adjust crime rates for the targeting of black people by cops (stop and frisk, for example), greater likelihood of overcharging for minor offenses, and the discrimination inherent in the unequal administration of justice by the courts. David and his ilk do not want anyone learning about institutional racism because they might find out that it alone produces racial disparities like the one he keeps quoting about black crime.
DeleteIf cops only stop black suspects and more readily convict black suspects (who cannot afford good lawyers, do not get diversion, are more harshly sentenced, cannot afford bail, and so on), then David's stats are not a fair measure of a group that may be no more criminal than white people, especially if you throw in uncharged white collar crime.
You know what would help a lot? It would be better for everyone if black folks would stop committing crimes.
DeleteIt wouldn't be good for Republicans.
DeleteLiberals who care about black Americans shouldn't be finding excuses to ignore the crime rate. Most victims of black criminals are other black Americans.
DeleteI am very concerned about the white collar crime rate, crimes that are committed largely by white people. Why is no one on the right complaining abut that? Why do they consistently let white collar criminals off the hook?
DeleteThey should start with that most famous of all white criminals, Trump. Prosecuting him would restore my faith in the justice system and prove that it isn't just black people who go to jail.
@6:27 Are you familiar with The Innocence Project. It is a group of lawyers that get black people out of jail when they are convicted for crimes they didn't commit. Did you know that such people exist? You don't have to commit a crime in order to be put in jail, if you are black. Being lazy, why should black people commit any crimes, if they can go to jail without committing one?
https://innocenceproject.org/all-cases/
Yes, I am quite familiar with the Innocence Project. They get unfairly convicted people of all races out of jail, not just blacks. I fully agree with you regarding white collar crime. I would like to see longer sentences for white collar criminals like Elizabeth Holmes.
DeleteI don't know the racial breakdown of white collar criminals. Do you have any data confirming that they are disproportionately white?
I don't think we should be selective about which white collar criminals get prosecuted. In fairness, all people suspected of crimes, assuming their is evidence, should be prosecuted. Not just people committing certain types of white collar crimes.
DeleteWhen black people are disproportionately convicted of crimes despite being innocent, shouldn't that be a concern about the fairness of our judicial system? But my concern initially was that the numbers you quote so often may be affected by the tendency to overcharge and falsely convict black people compared to white people. How can you know that black people commit disproportionately more crimes under such circumstances of uncertainty?
First of all, do we have data confirming that black people are falsely convicted and overcharged more often than white people? And, if we do have data, what is the magnitude of the difference?
DeleteFrankly, the difference in crime rate between blacks vs whites and Asians is so large that the factors you mention wouldn't change the conclusion. It's hard to find crime data by race. Some time ago, I did find murder statistics by race. As i recall, the black murder rate was something like seven times as large as the rate for whites.
I wish there were some way to separate out the black underclass from the black middle class. I assume that the high crime rate applies to the underclass, not at all to the middle class.
First, yes, there is evidence of that. Second, you can go look that up yourself. Use google, the way I would have to do.
DeleteHere is a thought for you to ponder. The crime rate for illegal immigrants is much lower than for whites or blacks or asians. Why do you think that might be? I think it may be because they don't want to be deported and thus avoid attracting police attention. If police have the belief that Asian and white people commit fewer crimes, and thus they focus their attention on black suspects, how will that not lead to more apprehensions and problems with the law (both guilty and innocent)?
How do you account for the fact that blacks commit far fewer mass shootings than white people? Do you know whether a charge of murder that was bargained down to involuntary manslaughter is included in those murder stats? If white people can afford better lawyers (fewer public defenders) and those lawyers get them off of the more serious charges, does that really mean they have committed fewer murders?
Do you think we should separate out the white upper class from the white and black middle classes when considering white collar crimes rates?
Ponder this too. For white wealthy people, most problems can be solved with money. When you have no money and are black, how do you solve those problems in living? For Asians, the problems get solved by relying on extended family. What if you do not have that resource?
Ponder this: People who weaken law enforcement, thinking they are helping blacks, are actually hurting all the hard-working, honest black people living in a high-crime black neighborhoods. Crime is a major problem for them and their families.
Delete"Do some teachers teach that white students should be embarrassed because of slavery? Do some teachers teachers teach that black students should be embarrassed because of the high black crime rate?"
DeleteDiC is correct on one point: we *don't* know how often this happens, and that makes it hard to assess whether the new state law in Florida is actually needed.
On further reflection, though, I find I rather like David's pair of questions. Let's imagine that both of the situations David imagines happened one day in a Florida school. Further, let's suppose that white students promptly complain to the school board about being instructed to feel shame over historical American slavery and black students complain equally quickly about being instructed to feel shame about crimes they didn't commit.
Does Florida's new law cover both of these complaints? Clearly, it does! Unless we have succumbed to the dumbness of our blue tribe, we only need to refer to the plain language of the law: NO student should be instructed they *must* feel shame for the actions of other people of the same race.
One would have to be wallowing in dumbness to read the law any other way!
When these mirror-image complaints land on the desks of school superintendents and administrators, state law plainly says they deserve equal consideration and equal remediation. Doesn't it?
There's just one problem, though. It's entirely conceivable that one--maybe both!--of these complaints could be dismissed as "woke." I'm reliably informed that "wokeness" is a major threat to our country, society, and way of life.
Is it possible that these two complaints are equally likely to be designated as "wokeness"? The clear text of the law doesn't say, but the plain text says "no student," so only a deeply dumb, deluded person would think there would be any difference in how the two complaints would be handled.
But just suppose--and stick with me here, this is going to be difficult--suppose only *one* of these complaints was called "woke." Are the chances the same for both complaints?
You can disagree and maybe this is my personal bias showing, but I think there's strong likelihood that only one complaint would be termed this way. Only one of the two complaints would be singled out as being in support of wokeness.
Now one last thing. Let's suppose that the new Florida law bears an offical title, something fair and just and good for everybody. We could call it Florida's "Personal Freedom Act." I mean, who doesn't like personal freedom? Only someone terminally dumb, that's who.
And just to put the final ridiculous touch on my little imaginary scenario, let's imagine the state's governor, instead of calling this new law by it's proper title, dubs it the "Stop W.O.K.E. Act."
Crazy, right?
I mean, this is just how dumb you have to be to imagine that this law creates a mechanism exclusively for one group to complain about being instructed to feel shame.
And that's just how dumb I am.
Wow! While I was napping David has been covering some serious territory! He's gone from parsing the meaning of "no student" to providing a pair of hypothetical examples of teaching that violate the law, and quickly moves on to tell us that one of his two offending examples is actually accurate, and finally to asserting that those who "weaken law enforcement" are the real racists.
DeleteOne must credit him with industriousness even if he isn't strictly sticking to the point.
David may not recognize the point you are making.
DeleteQuaker in a Basement, Wokeness is the belief that over time, certain propensities are inherent as to our melanin levels.
DeleteI’m just dumb enough to believe that any hint of a minority kid being screwed, glued, and tattooed as to his propensities would be a showboat gift from Gaia straight to governor’s PR office.
Not even close Cecelia.
DeleteAnonymouse 11:17pm, blogboard anonymices are nothing so much as they are political, but they have zero political instincts or insight.
DeleteCecelia: That sounds more to me like a definition of whiteness. Some folks have problems with learning that *other* white people acted in ways that caused harm to others. They feel personally blamed and shamed. What's the connection between the white people of the past and the white people who don't want to bear their shame?
DeleteWhiteness.
Of course, if you really *don't* think your skin color defines you, then the truth about others who share the same skin color shouldn't worry you.
Right?
No, Quaker In The Basement, we must always be concerned when people assume things about others based upon physical characteristics. We must always oppose that and recognize that the assumption of mass identification, guilt, or even the impulse of tribalism based upon such a pretext is the essence of racism. It is THE problem.
DeleteCecelia,
DeleteFrom your lips to the ears of every police officer in the USA.
Anonymouse 10:38am, from my lips to my ears, your ears, everybody’s ears.
DeleteInfantilizing people based upon skin color is just as bad as villainizing them.
The GOP should reach across the aisle to remove Robert Menendez.
ReplyDeletehttps://jabberwocking.com/republicans-cant-afford-to-attack-robert-menendez/
Commander senses which agents were working with Trump on 1/6 and is righteously biting those treasonous bastards!!!
ReplyDeleteFor those who enjoy a thorough debunking of History As It Is Taught: This week we received our copy of Michael Harriot's long-awaited "Black AF History."
ReplyDeleteI'm only a few pages in, but I've seen enough to give my wholehearted recommendation. Harriot is incisive and hilarious as his readers have come to expect.
I assume there is a lot of stupid stuff in Bob’s post today but…”Taylor Swift’s latest desperate search for Nationwide public attention…” Say WHAT?” Is Bob really THAT out of it? We could try to concoct an out of touch statement for some time and not top that.
ReplyDeleteBut, this is probably just another way of Bob showing solidarity with that Trump right. They are cheesed off at her for standing up for her country while fools and crooks are trying to flush it down the toilet. Obviously, even for oldsters like me and Bob who are not interested in her music, She needs attention less than any other American alive. Trashy Trump supporters hate her because She gives a crap about the Country.
Somerby says that the Fox & Friends discussion of Taylor Swift was "brain-damaged." Brain-damaged! Saying that F&F carries on "brain-damaged" discussions is an awfully odd way of "showing solidarity with that Trump right."
DeleteHe then turns around and recommends that people watch Fox more, and also criticizes the mainstream media way more than that single remark about Fox. Note that his statement is restricted to their Taylor Swift discussion only.
DeleteHow is Somerby showing solidarity with the right today? He goes on at length mocking the Bidens' problem with their dog and praising Fox for covering it at length at 7 am (ET). He throws in the gratuitous remark about Biden stumbling. We are left with a worse net impression of Biden than of Fox.
Does anyone believe that Somerby thinks anyone at Fox is literally brain-damaged? No. Does anyone believe that Somerby thinks Biden has a dog problem and stumbled because he is old? Absolutely. Is Somerby's statement about Fox in any way damaging to them? No. Is his statement about Biden damaging? Yes, and it actually repeats today's talking points on the right about Biden, adding to the drip drip drip of "Biden is old" "Biden can't do any thing right, not even with his dog" propaganda against Biden.
I am spelling this out for you because you don't seem to recognize what is happening here in Somerby's essays from day to day.
I don't have time to fact-check all your crazy assertions, so let's just take the very first one:
Delete"[Somerby] then turns around and recommends that people watch Fox more"
Here's what Somerby actually says:
-- "Friends don't let friends watch Fox & Friends, an ancient proverb teaches."
-- "More than twenty years ago, we became the first observer to say that Fox & Friends was the dumbest TV news program of all time."
-- "Our own blue cable is bad enough; red cable goes off the charts."
-- "Fox and Friends is astoundingly dumb."
That's your idea of "recommending that people watch Fox more?"
It’s hard to believe Dogface doesn’t actually see thru Trump as well. Apparently Fox is making a federal case out of Taylor Swift. Maybe they should be running scared. But Dogface, anyway you slice it, the contention that Swift is desperate for attention is ring wing and nuts on the face of it. She better not say “Happy Holidays” this year.,
DeleteIf you confuse a generic slam with a reasoned criticism, you are a lost cause. He doesn't criticize Fox, but he does criticize Biden and the mainstream media. When I explain and explain and someone still doesn't get it, I assume their obtuseness is motivated.
DeleteFor every statement you list above, I can find one where Somerby has claimed that Fox has better facts than MSNBC or that lefties should hear what Fox is saying because they won't hear about it on their own stations, or that the right is better informed than the mainstream media (because they hear different shit about Trayvon Martin or George Floyd or Michael Brown).
You are being excessively literal, like Somerby. Perhaps you are his sockpuppet after all? You are certainly taking Somerby too much at face value.
Commander is brain-damaged.
DeleteActually, Somerby is criticizing Fox severely for its focus on brain-dead, right-wing talking points - Commander, Taylor Swift, Biden "nearly" stumbling.
DeleteHe would prefer that media outlets of all stripes spend more time on real problems such as the absurd amounts we pay for health care or the achievement gaps between black/Latino students and white/Asian students.
George, in comments here, it's called The Daily Gaslighting.
DeleteHence, you can't "seem to recognize" Bob he really didn't say what he said about Fox but "recommends that people watch Fox more".
Common Gaslighting techniques:
Compulsively Lying
Distorting Reality
Twisting the Truth
Negative Name-Calling
Scapegoating Others
Pitting One Person Against Another
Constant Deflection
We are dealing with a very damaged person who is
... getting off by psychologically torturing other people in comments.
DeleteA common way Gaslighting is used is to deflect criticism. (I know!!)
DeleteThe Daily Gaslighters are protecting the Democratic Party from criticism as they may have wrapped their identity in it very deeply. I'm sure the motives are complicated and add up to something very sad.
Let's all pray or whatever we do for this person who deserves better!!
That's about as silly as calling Taylor Swift homely.
DeleteWho did the actual reporting this morning about Trump's conviction for fraud? Somerby doesn't even mention it -- are we to believe he was too concerned about dogbites to care about a major conviction of a former president, for fraud? That judgment is a big deal. Unlike Fox's coverage of Taylor Swift or Commander.
But I'm the one gaslighting people? I don't think so. You guys are just too easy when it comes to Somerby's deviousness.
If this is too distressing for you, I suggest that you get a personal service dog to help you feel calmer.
The gaslighting actually reinforces everything Somerby says.
DeleteThe lady doth compulsively lie and distort reality too much! :D
7:33 thank you for sharing. Appreciate it.
DeleteTry a google search and see whether Somerby has ever, even once, recommended that someone watch MSNBC.
DeleteOr read this, in which Somerby trashes Maddow up and down the street, while defending Fox coverage:
http://dailyhowler.blogspot.com/2014/10/supplemental-vastly-misstating-what.html
Tell me Somerby thinks Fox is brain-damaged in that essay.
Here is Somerby's most recent suggestion that we watch more Fox News:
"Not that there's anything wrong with it! But we sit and watch for hours and hours and hours. Lucky for us, we get to feel safe among our cadre of imaginary dear, dear friends.
We ignore the topics flogged by the imaginary friends on Fox. But some of those topics are real.
"Segregation now," George Wallace once said. This is a pseudo-journalistic version of that destructive instinct."
http://dailyhowler.blogspot.com/2023/09/segregation-now-we-watch-for-hours-and.html
What does Somerby mean by the reference to George Wallace? If you read the entire essay, he is saying that MSNBC viewers should pay more attention to Fox because sometimes their topics are "real". That means not lies and disinformation. But how is a Fox viewer supposed to know what is real and what is not? Somerby never says.
From Sept 7, 2023:
"If you turn to the Fox News Channel, the propaganda which starts at 5 o'clock each morning would merely be comically awful in a different world. In this world, that clowning, and our own tribe's studied cluelessness, defines an existential crisis—and let this also be said:
Watching Fox, you will sometimes see discussions of actual topics and actual problems which our own tribunes disappear!"
Notice what happened here: (1) the media liberals watch was denigrated, (2) FOX was given a generic put-down and then we are told that they have facts we won't hear in the mainstream media, (3) no discussion of how you separate the facts on Fox from the non-stop propaganda.
http://dailyhowler.blogspot.com/2023/09/a-large-diverse-nation-cant-function.html
I hear you 7:51. Thanks for putting this list together.
Delete“ He would prefer that media outlets of all stripes spend more time on real problems ”
DeleteSure, “dogface”. That’s why he mentions it so often (lol) and spends so much time talking about … Fox talking about Biden’s dog and Taylor Swift’s heresies and being disappointed in Pete Hegseth. (Note: that means he spends his time watching Pete Hegseth and Fox and friends, where you will not see reporting about achievement gaps.)
Just yesterday, he told you the ravings of the nut Levin should be reported in the mainstream media. How would that further the discussion of healthcare, I ask you?
The Roosevelt’s dogs got hacked off by trousers.
Delete“In separate incidents, Franklin D. Roosevelt's dog Major (who was also a German Shepherd) bit United States Senator Hattie Wyatt Caraway, and attacked Prime Minister of the United Kingdom Ramsay MacDonald, tearing MacDonald's pants off.[19][20][21]
Theodore Roosevelt's bull terrier Pete bit numerous people, even tearing the pants off of ambassador of France to the United States Jean Jules Jusserand.”
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Major_(Joe_Biden%27s_dog)
And need I remind you that he has written hundreds of posts complaining that Trump is insane and deserves pity (for crying out loud) and that the news media should be talking about that, not trying to report on his misdeeds! Maybe one tenth of those posts he could have devoted to healthcare, but no…
DeleteHe may have suggested on Monday that the type of craziness Levin communicating should be news because it is a "real problem".
DeleteHe spelled that out pretty clearly on Monday. But then again I am obtuse and can't see through the illusion foisted here where the words spoken mean something different that what they ordinarily mean.
"He has written hundreds of posts complaining Trump is insane and that the news media should not trying to report on his misdeeds"
DeleteCommon Gaslighting techniques:
Compulsively Lying
Distorting Reality
Twisting the Truth
Negative Name-Calling
Scapegoating Others
Pitting One Person Against Another
Constant Deflection
mh - stop lying and gaslighting.
DeleteI am not going to run off and find quotes from Somerby every time some troll complains about gaslighting. That is just yanking our chain here. You've already drunk the Kool-aid on the right and there is no reason for you to be here at a supposedly liberal blog, if Somerby were the straightforward blogger you claim he is. The abundance of right wing trolls and fan-boys here is the best proof that he is not what he pretends to be.
DeleteIf you cannot do implication and cannot read between the lines and do not recognize figurative language and buy-into Somerby's excess literalism, that is YOUR problem. It may even explain why you are right wingers, but your accusations against those of us complaining about Somerby are indeed confessions.
mh, you guys are a hoot. When Bob blasts a media outlet or the media in general, you set your hair on fire and cry that he should be ripping Fox.
DeleteThen when Bob rips Fox, you go nuts because Bob watched Fox…
You and your crew either live your lives in traction or you’re triple jointed.
Compulsively Lying
DeleteDistorting Reality
Twisting the Truth
Negative Name-Calling
Scapegoating Others
Pitting One Person Against Another
Constant Deflection
8:38/lying gaslighter:
Delete"This is a logical fallacy known as "circular reasoning" or "begging the question." It occurs when someone uses an unsupported claim as part of their argument and then relies on that claim to support their argument further. In essence, it's a flawed and circular way of reasoning because it doesn't provide any real evidence or logical basis for the argument."
"Gaslighting is the circular conversation that you have where no one ever wins. It is the argument that never ends, because there is no resolution that is satisfactory to the narcissist, who never compromises."
DeleteDescribes mh, not mh perfectly.
Anonymices: “Bob, why are you watching MSNC and CNN and criticizing them, rather than doing that to Fox? Liberals don’t act like that!”
DeleteAlso Anonymices: “Bob, why the hell are you watching Fox and slamming it rather than watching real news on MSNBC? This proves you’re not a liberal!”
gaslight definition: "manipulate (someone) using psychological methods into questioning their own sanity or powers of reasoning"
DeleteWhy do you trolls never know the meanings of the words you use?
Nothing about narcissism, nothing about circularity, nothing about compromise. You no doubt think you are saying something but who knows what?
Cecelia, Somerby does not slam Fox. Just like he doesn't criticize Trump. He calls a few broad names (crazy, braindead, dumb) and then moves on to trashing mainstream media, reporters, and his favorite targets (today it is Morning Joe again).
DeleteWhat is wrong with Somerby that he has nothing to say about the Trump judgment? Why would Morning Joe talk about the president's dog in the face of that much more important news story? And why did Somerby not explain why Morning Joe is braindead for reporting on such a story?
Both of those statements are true. I think you believe there is a contradiction, but there isn't. If Somerby were liberal, he wouldn't be watching so much Fox. He wouldn't be able to stand it. AND he wouldn't be criticizing mainstream media to the point of calling them as bad as Fox when they are not.
Liberals do not behave the way Somerby does unless they have gone over to the dark side. Somerby is not the only one to have done this, as we discussed last week.
Anonymouse 9:15pm, agreed.
DeleteAnonymices aren’t gaslighting anybody.That’s not for lack of trying by anonynomices, but Charles Boyer, you are not.
Could this be considered an example of trying to get someone to question their reasoning?
Delete"You no doubt think you are saying something but who knows what?"
CHAT:
Yes, the statement you provided can be considered an example of trying to get someone to question their reasoning. It challenges the clarity and validity of the person's statement, suggesting that their point may be unclear or even unfounded. This type of statement can be used in a debate or discussion to prompt the person to reflect on their argument and provide more substantial reasoning or evidence.
Is the quote manipulative?
CHAT
The quote you provided could be seen as somewhat confrontational and potentially manipulative, as it challenges the other person's thoughts and can make them doubt their reasoning. However, whether it's manipulative or not largely depends on the context, tone, and intention behind the statement. If it's used in a respectful and constructive manner to encourage critical thinking and open dialogue, it may not be manipulative. But if it's used to belittle or undermine the person's perspective without a genuine desire for productive discussion, it could be considered manipulative.
Does the quote attempt to make a person doubt their reasoning?
CHAT
Yes, the quote does attempt to make a person doubt their reasoning. It questions the clarity and validity of the person's statement, suggesting that they may not be expressing themselves clearly or that their reasoning may be unclear. The aim here is to prompt the individual to reevaluate and potentially improve their reasoning or argument.
Anonymouse 9:22pm, I think that may have something to do with that ole stumbling block you have about Bob’s focus on the media. Although, you do manage to demand that he should be watching whatever you’re watching.
DeleteYou don’t like his media focus and you don’t like him. He doesn’t give a rip.
I don’t watch cable news.
DeleteWhat is with Somerby saying he will skip an embarrassing statement by Jill Biden's spokesperson and then quoting it verbatim? And what exactly is embarrassing about that statement? It states that the dog is upset by the many people around it, behaving in ways it obviously finds threatening to either itself or one of the Bidens (dogs are protective and some are more so than others).
ReplyDeleteMy daughter has a dog that is part German Shepard. It growls and nips at neighborhood children engaged in rough housing with my grandson, an active 11 year old boy. She has worked very hard to get the dog to stop doing that, because it scares neighbor parents, but it is difficult to get a dog to betray its nature if it considers itself the guardian of territory and people to whom it is loyal.
People with dogs should sympathize, not ridicule the Bidens, their dog or their spokesperson, who expressed appropriate concern about "nips" which may or may not break the skin, but certainly aren't pitbull attacks.
Is Somerby just being an asshole about the dog or does he have some point to make? Whatever he is thinking, he doesn't say anything direct and is once again annoyingly coy. Somerby of course heard about this on Fox, because it isn't news and because it portrays the Bidens in a bad light among those who dislike or don't understand dogs.
Trump has no dog and dislikes dogs. That is not a good recommendation for him as a person. There is a reason why candidates tend to produce ads showing their spouses, their kids and their dogs. In CO, dogs are so important that there are brewpubs where you bring your dog.
Given Somerby's response to this incident, I suspect he is more like Trump than Biden when it comes to personal warmth and ability to relate to others. Who would lack empathy for those involved in this situation, to the point of calling the family's apology "embarrassing?"
Dogs that “nip” at people should be terminated.
Delete"According to Shear, Commander has sent at least one officer to the hospital."
DeleteI went to the emergency room because my daughter's dog and I were playing frisbie and he anticipated my throw and instead caught the skin on the back of my hand with one of his teeth. It was in no way intentional by either of us, but he is a big active dog who is enthusiastic at play.
The emergency room staff because very alert when I said the dog hurt my hand and they asked many questions aimed at determining whether the dog needed to be detained or reported to authorities. I'm sure that happned with the Bidens' dog too. In my case, I did not know how to dress the wound on my hand because my skin is very fragile and could not be stitched. They used tape and steri-strips. It may be that the secret service agent needed a tetanus shot or assurance that rabies was not an issue, or similarly need stitches or wound dressing. That happens at a hospital. Or it could be that they wanted to make sure the wound was well cleaned and that he received an antibiotic, since puncture wounds can be nasty. It doesn't mean the officer didn't go home within hours, nor that he didn't recover from an essentially minor injury. But the hospital sure does sound scary!!!
Dogs have both teeth and claws. They get excited and they jump around and sometimes secret service or cops may make things worse by appearing intimidating to the dog (or to the person the dog feels responsible for protecting). It is not the dog's fault when someone is injured in a situation that was not necessarily any kind of attack. That's perhaps why the statement was worded as it was. I had to be very careful what I said about my daughter's dog (all of which was the truth), to avoid getting an over-zealous person concerned enough to send the dog to the pound. Fortunately, I am intelligent enough to recognize the concern and allay it quickly. I hope the Bidens were similarly on top of the situation.
As to the claim about 11 nips. Why would anyone expect a dog to change its nature in a situation that continues to be confusing or upsetting for it? Biden is going to continue living in the White House until the end of his term, at least. Many people consider their dogs members of their family. I have no doubt that the Bidens have tried to help their dog, but when the roster of other people in their quarters is constantly changing, how do you help the secret service learn to avoid antagonizing that member of the Biden family? It is as much the secret service's responsibility to behave in a dog-friendly way, as it is the Biden's to teach their dog to be less dog-like. This may be difficult for both sides, human and canine.
"Is Somerby just being an asshole about the dog or does he have some point to make? Whatever he is thinking, he doesn't say anything direct and is once again annoyingly coy."
DeleteSince you seem to have some difficulties with reading comprehension, let me quote Somerby's thesis today, which he states directly and uncoyly:
"Fox & Friends is astoundingly dumb. In our view, blue cable isn't sufficiently better."
I again forgot to give my nym - the last post was by Dogface George.
DeleteAny dog can nip when they are startled or feel threatened. It is how they warn people when they are frightened.
DeleteShall we put down all dogs? Shall we start with yours? Oh, you don't have one? What a surprise!
George, I think you may have discovered for yourself another reason why people don't bother using a nym.
Delete"Dogs that “nip” at people should be terminated."
DeleteSay what you will about my hatred of the Right, but I never suggested they be terminated.
The right are human. Dogs aren’t.
DeleteSomeone who only cares about humans (usually just themselves, not others) and cannot empathize with dogs or any other species, is lacking the kind of warmth that usually characterizes human beings.
DeleteYou terminate animals when they are in old age, sick, injured, and suffering. Because they are suffering. Not because they are inconvenient. Grow a heart, asshole.
I haven't seen a whole lot of evidence of right wing humanity in this situation, especially judging by you.
If a predator attacks a human, it gets terminated.
DeleteEven a chimpanzee that attacks a human gets terminated.
DeleteSomeone who calls a pet dog “a predator” is deeply weird.
DeleteEver notice that service animals don’t nip people? That’s why they’re allowed to go where other animals aren’t.
DeleteDo you know that most of the dogs initially selected for service dog training wash out because they cannot behave properly under the conditions of their work? See the film "Pick of the Litter". Commander is not a service dog. Their training starts in puppyhood and Commander was not in the White House and his family had no idea any of them would be there when Commander was a puppy.
DeleteCommander is unsuited for his present role, so he needs to move on.
DeleteI took a more charitible view and credited Our Host with a pithy paraphrase of the F&F presentation on the matter. If Swift is making a "desperate" play for attention, she's rather good at it, if ticket sales are a reliable measure.
ReplyDeleteSorry all. My reply is aimed for Anon 5:38.
DeleteSorry, but Somerby quoted (NOT paraphrased) the White House spokesperson's statement.
DeleteAnyone can look at Swift and see that she is far from homely. Another instance in which a lie is blatantly obvious and yet still told.
"At any rate, our various friends on Fox & Friends discussed this event, at substantial length, at the start of the 7 o'clock hour."
ReplyDeleteThe news was reported in many places, including MSN, USA Today, and The Washington Post. If Somerby is trying to say that only Fox jumped on this story, he is wrong again. Perhaps his "embarrassment" over Jill Biden's spokesperson's statement arises from whatever nasty tone he encountered over at Fox. I told my husband that Somerby was embarrassed and he said "Why would Somerby be embarrassed by that?"
I do see an analogy between the way Fox expects Biden to treat his adult son who has had drug problems (e.g., tough love, cut him off) and the expectation that Biden should have his dog put down or confined to a kennel or otherwise banished from the family. I do recall that some people were horrified when Romney strapped his dog kennel to the roof of the family car (with the dog inside) and others so no problem with that behavior. The others were mostly Republicans supporting Romney for president. At least they are being consistent about their belief that a dog is less important than counting political coup.
Joe Biden, a white male, lets his dog bite people. Bob Somerby, also a white male, feels shame and guilt. What’s hard to understand about that?
DeleteIf Joe Biden told his dog "kill Commander" or "sic em," he would be letting his dog bite people. Short of that, we don't even know whether Biden was even in the same room when Commander nipped at a secret service person.
DeleteI get that you are being sardonic, but Somerby's shame would be as real as that of those poor poor AP students who felt such anguish upon learning that black people feel bad when they are treated badly.
Commander behaves badly, but other dogs don’t feel guilty.
DeleteMy dog bit you? I wasn’t there, so I’m not responsible.
DeleteAnonymouse 7:13pm, the Biden’s first dog at the WH, Major, bit people eight days in a row before he was exiled to Delaware.
DeleteMajor is proud as punch over that record.
Are you suggesting that Biden didn't pay the medical bill? I'm pretty sure he did.
Delete"In 2022, dogs attacked more than 5,300 employees who were delivering the mail, according to the U.S. Postal Service. It was a slight drop from the previous year, when more than 5,400 postal employees were attacked."
The job of a secret service agent is similarly hazardous:
"Avideo has emerged showing the immediate aftermath of a recent accident involving one of the Secret Service’s so-called Roadrunners — a heavily modified Ford F350 Super Duty variant that normally forms part of a U.S. presidential motorcade and which we have discussed on more than one occasion in the past. This newest version of the Roadrunner first emerged in 2018.
According to initial reports, the vehicle — which has a unique six-door design — crashed while traveling to Live Oak, Florida, on September 2. The Roadrunner was headed there ahead of a visit by President Joe Biden, who was surveying the destruction from Hurricane Idalia and meeting victims of the storm."
Attacking a man through his dog is pretty low.
Attacking a man through his dogs, Anonymouse 9:01pm. Plural.
DeleteYes, that means it isn't Major's or Commander's fault because they are bad dogs, but something about the new environment they are in that they are having trouble handling. But Fox doesn't care about the dogs; they care about making Biden appear incompetent or foolish or negligent because his dogs have had problems adjusting to where they are living.
DeleteThere should be no surprise that Fox would do this over a dog. They have been attacking Joe Biden for a long time, over his son's psychological and drug problems (after the death of his sister and mother, followed by the death later of his brother). The right wing doesn't care who is collateral damage when they go for the political jugular. It is a very ugly trait that causes a lot of people to become cynical about politics in general, but this is the famous lack of empathy on the right, in action. Hurting people is what they do.
In your daily and day-long ritual of pretending to wring your hands, your description “going for the jugular” makes the subject matter all the more humorous.
DeleteThere is yet another fake Hunter Biden story circulating today. Do you imagine the Bidens find that stuff humorous?
DeleteAnonymous 11:14pm, I just know what I find humorous and that’s your dire concern that anyone would complain or be aghast at the number of working people who get bitten on the job at the WH and that there is yet another “fake” Hunter Biden story.
DeleteNothing is as funny as thinking a Right-winger knows something about economics.
DeleteNothing.
Cecelia, these are not White House staff being bitten. They are secret service, and in this last case, a Secret Service Uniformed Division police officer. That makes them folks who would be (1) changing and thus unfamiliar to the dog, (2) in close proximity to the president and his family due to their duties, thus evoking protective instincts in the dog. Stop pretending that the dog is randomly biting people or has bit the cook. That is just trying to bend facts to make the dog look out of control when it is doing what certain breeds of dogs do. German Shepards are loyal and protective, as a breed.
DeleteIt’s time for Commander to go!
DeleteThis emphasis on Commander's crimes may be intended to deflect attention from Trump's summary judgment of fraud handed down around 7 am this morning (while Somerby was busy watching Fox News complain about a dog).
ReplyDeleteIf Trump can be convicted of fraud, any one of us who commits it can too.
Delete7:27,
DeleteIt's worse than you think. Bob's column today distracted attention from the judgment against Trump by mentioning the judgment against Trump:
'"on Morning Joe, a different collection of cable news friends were discussing the fact that "a New York judge ruled on Tuesday that Donald J. Trump persistently committed fraud by inflating the value of his assets, and stripped the former president of control over some of his signature New York properties."'
Deviousness! Thy name is Bob!
But what does Somerby do then? He suggests we watch Fox.
DeleteThey didn't just strip Trump of two properties, but they are now beginning the penalty phase of the trial, which will determine what additional properties may be confiscated, whether his company will remain in business and what fines will be imposed.
This is a very big deal. Do you think that small paragraph, not about Trump or the trial, but about what Morning Joe was doing, reflects the seriousness of this summary judgment.
Then Somerby says: "Fox & Friends is astoundingly dumb. In our view, blue cable isn't sufficiently better."
So, discussing that very serious verdict affecting the former president is "not sufficiently better" than discussing Taylor Swift? In what universe? Somerby himself is being very dumb with this remark. But what exactly was wrong with covering the ex president's legal troubles? The man is a candidate for the presidency and he was just convicted of major fraud. But the blue stations are just as bad as Fox for covering this news?
And the bulk of the essay is devoted to making Biden look bad because his dog bit someone (not Biden himself, his fucking dog). And he fell down, which Somerby thinks means he is too old to be president. That's what Somerby devoted his essay to.
I guess you figure that if you keep repeating the falsehood that Somerby says we should watch Fox, we’ll end up believing it.
DeleteBelieve whatever you want.
DeleteDoes Fox no longer represent the viewpoint of "the Others", who we need to acknowledge the viewpoints of?
DeleteCommander shouldn’t be nipping the secret service. He should nip Taylor Swift.
ReplyDeleteAs Thomas Perry said in his book The Old Man (made into a recent streaming series), all dogs want to be good dogs. The secret service is not there to protect Biden's dogs and the dogs perhaps sense that attitude. Our world would be better if all people wanted to be good people.
DeleteDogs just want to enjoy a good nip.
DeleteDogs want to please people. When they don't, it isn't usually their fault.
DeleteRead some of Cassidy's Hutchinson's new book about the chaos in the White House and then try to imagine a dog in the midst of it. Even in the residence parts of the White House, there are unfamiliar people doing things that a dog would not understand and causing situations that are difficult for a previously well-trained not-nipping dog to handle. Dogs aren't built for chaos any more than most people are.
Cut the dog some slack. That multiple dogs have had this same problem, as Cecelia mentioned earlier, demonstrates that this is unlikely to be Biden's fault or his dog's fault, unless you believe presidents are not entitled to pets.
It is incredibly stupid that Fox has been making a big deal out of this, but that is because they hate Biden. Using a dog is about as low as attacking the President's wife or kids for political reasons. Fox has shown no restraint in attacking Jill Biden either, as Somerby echoes when he calls her spokeperson's statement "embarrassing" without explanation. Attacking Biden, whether himself or his wife or his dog, is the point of Fox's coverage. Let's not pretend otherwise.
Anonymouse 9:08pm, although this whole dogs bitting WH staff thing has been very difficult, hard, unfair and callous toward the Biden family, , perhaps a Secret Service agent (or eight) does wonder why it’s gone from eight attacks to eleven being a trip back to Dover, and why don’t they just get a Yorkie-poo.
DeleteZero tolerance for nipping.
DeleteNo doubt Commander knows more about economics than any Right-wing voter.
DeleteThere is an issue of fairness in considering the stresses on the dog and not just the nipping. Republicans aren't concerned with fairness, unless it affects them personally.
ReplyDeleteAnonymouse 9:50am, for most people, the foremost consideration of any environmental stressor for dog , is about how we can keep another human from being bitten.
ReplyDeleteIm afraid that the feelings of the dog, the fairness of his stressors, the feelings of his owners and their fans, are down the road from that.
human > canine
Delete