FRIDAY, AUGUST 18, 2023
The childishness of the whale: As we noted at the start of the week, Rep. Steve Cohen (D-Tenn.) has been involved in a search for the truth.
Last Sunday, C-Span's Washington Journal played tape of the congressman's description of his search. The childishness of the modern American discourse was captured in one part of his remarks.
Should the federal trials of Donald J. Trump be televised? Rep. Cohen said yes, they should be:
COHEN (8/5/23): We have seen our nation become more divided than any time, I guess, since the Civil War. It's totally divided, but it's divided now, not on whether you are in favor of slavery or against slavery, it's [on] whether or not you see facts and admit that they're the truth or not.
We have a problem just in seeing reality and the facts and working off the same song sheet.
We are siloed by cable television. If you watch MSNBC and CNN, you see a certain version of the news, which I think is the truth. And if you watch Fox or Newsmax or some of those stations, you see fiction, and that is why they had multi hundreds of millions of dollar judgments against them for lying about Dominion Voting and other things on Fox, and they're going to have others.
But we need to make sure that the people can watch this, and see it on their own, and not have to watch it through the eyes and ears of Fox and Newsmax, who would take Trump's position and tilt and switch the perspectives to be what Trump wants. And not the truth.
The truth needs to be seen, because otherwise they don't accept the judgment, and I'm just assuming—you know, he is presumed innocent, but I think he is guilty as Al Capone, as anybody can be. If they do not see the trial, they might not accept it, because on Fox they will show this as being something like Florence Nightingale.
Rep. Cohen was surely right on several scores. Under current arrangements, we Americans are indeed deeply divided on a partisan political basis.
Why are we so deeply divided? Rep. Cohen was right once again! In substantial part, it's because we're "siloed by cable television" and by the highly partisan behavior of other partisan "news orgs."
Rep. Cohen got those points right—but after that, the deluge. How childish is modern American discourse? As you can see above, Rep. Cohen also said this:
"We are siloed by cable television. If you watch MSNBC and CNN, you see a certain version of the news, which I think is the truth."
What we see on MSNBC is "the truth!" It's hard to be more childish or clueless than that—and yet, within our self-impressed blue tribe, this is very much Us.
Om the whole, our cable tribunes are storebought corporate players. They serve us our one favorite form of gruel:
Trump Trump Trump Trump Jail!
They serve us that gruel and they serve little else. We're dumb enough to keep lapping it up.
Few other topics ever intrude on this diet of "the truth." And yet we somehow maintain the fiction that we the blue tribe deeply care about human life around the world, and about the living of life within our own borders.
Our tribunes hide from certain topics which get wide play on Fox. Sometimes, existing situations are so unattractive, so out of control, that the red tribe corporates over on Fox don't even have to make a big pile of stupid sh*t up.
Meanwhile, our tribunes continue to peddle TrumpJail.
Ever since Mueller's name was first mentioned, Trump has supposedly been on the verge of being frog-marched to jail. Reliably, we keep tuning in, begging for more gruel.
Routinely, though not always, Fox is an embarrassment. Are we sure that our channel is dispensing "the truth," even about the likely or possible outcomes of our upcoming Trump trials?
"What is truth?" Pontius Pilate once asked. For today, we'll allow ourselves to leave it at this:
It isn't what's seen on our own tribal channels! This afternoon, we'll link to the very rare New York Times guest essay which lets the bullroar out.
This afternoon: A very important guest essay
Tomorow: Why does Weissmann say this?
Bob now simply expects what’s left of his audience to agree that MSNBC is laughable and or evil. He doesn’t feel he needs to make any case.
ReplyDeleteBut while Bob has been consistently correct on matters Trump, Bob gets everything wrong, sitting on the sideline dreaming the great man will somehow get off.
MSNBC and CNN are much closer to the truth than Fox and Newsmax. For one thing, MSNBC and CNN try to get it right. Newsmax and Fox News try to approximate right wing talking points and beyond that, they are furthering Republican goals (such as defending Trump and advancing culture wars). They think that truth is whatever they say it is, that there are "alternative" facts, that what matters is their side winning.
ReplyDeleteMSNBC and CNN are not perfect but at least they are trying. Who gets closer to the truth? Bona fide academics whose job is to identify and analyze and form theories to explain truth in the world. They are bound by ethics. Do some people occasionally violate those ethics? Of course, people being people and sometimes subverted by other priorities, such as gaining tenure or being famous. But there is a mechanism called peer review that helps identify fraud and keeps academics telling the truth. Journalism doesn't have that.
Somerby reserves his greatest wrath for academics and other experts. He focuses second on MSNBC and CNN. Within those categories, he is much more likely to attack women than men and his special target is Rachel Maddow, even though she is not involved much in journalism any more -- focusing instead on history using her doctoral training to uncover and present truth about our past.
Somerby never attacks the liars, the disinformation, those on the right who are getting it wrong on purpose. That's because Somerby only pretends to care about truth, while manufacturing nitpicks in order portray the mainstream press and untrustworthy, so that people will be more easily taken in by the right wing. That is an unworthy goal for a man in his last decade or so of life.
I sincerely hope it is economic necessity and not conviction that has driven Somerby to this sad decline, where he tells us that truth is important, then pretends that liars are speaking it.
Well said, though Bob seems to be shifting to a position that the truth DOES
DeleteNOT matter. Probably inevitable product of years of excuse making for Trump.
For all the problems with MSNBC, they have spent years getting in right on the Trump disaster. Many of there qualified commentators do effectively explain what’s going to the layman. This is when Bob goes into “Trump Trump Trump.” He has no counter arguments, because he knows they are correct.
Delete"... yet we somehow maintain the fiction that we the blue tribe deeply care about human life around the world, and about the living of life within our own borders."
DeleteDoubling down on the doubledown.
11:56,
DeleteThere's a lot of claptrap to choose from here but I'll zero in on the lowest hanging fruit. How does it make sense to posit 'economic necessity' as the reason for Bob's saddening moral decline?
Are there subliminal ads on this site that Bob is raking in $ on? Is he hawking TDH t-shirts somewhere and if so, where can I get one?
Hector, some of us suspect Bob has a right wing sugar daddy. But we have no proof.
DeleteNo proof!
DeleteSurely you have some evidence, a blurry photo or a scratchy recording?
The point where Somerby made a hard right turn was around age 65, which is when many people retire. It seems reasonable to assume he needs the money. Oligarchs and deep money sources have been funding a variety of right wing extremists and ratfuckers. Why not Somerby?
DeleteThe evidence is the abrupt shift in topics and targets here at this blog. I went back and traced it to 2015.
No Hector… it’s a circumstantial. But circumstantial evidence can be convincing.😊5:34 Bob seemed to insist Gore be given a fair shake, given the way the press operates he was on solid ground. But mostly he leans right, though borrowing from progressives to justify the Right.
DeleteI was reading Bob from the very first and his basic topic hasn't changed: logic, thought itself. Bob is a logician at heart.
DeleteDoes Bob write like a right-wing extremist when he says Trump seems to have an 'anti-social personality disorder', that he exhibits 'manifest strangeness', that he must be 'stripped of the power to do harm', that it would be 'very dire' if Trump were re-elected', and that he'd like to see Trump 'bady defeated'?
What kind of return are these right-wing plutocrats getting on their investment?
He then argues that Trump should be pitied not prosecuted. And he says that Trump believes what he says, so he is not lying. Trump’s supporters agree that he is not lying. Then Somerby spends the rest of his space attacking the left, as a supposed liberal who holds the left responsible for Trump and all of civilization’s ills. And you think he’s a logician!
DeleteHis attempts at logic are regularly dismantled in comments.
8:44,
DeleteIt is inaccurate to say Bob attacks 'the left'; rather, he attacks the liberal media and that is not the same thing.
And if accusing Somerby of holding the left responsible for all of civilization's ills is an example of him being dismantled in the comments, then I have won that argument.
It is accurate to say he attacks MSNBC on Trump, though he sticks to generalized and personal attacks; they tend to say things that are true and reasoned, and he is a big baby. And no Hector, the blog started out to be about the flaws in the coverage of the political world and he was even handed. He covered Fox and CNN. At some point, quite intentionally he stopped covering Fox almost completely. Slowly he started blaming the outrages of the right and its Press on the left. Hardly logical, highly suspect.
DeleteHe calls all of us liberals, his readers, to blame because our country is sliding into the sea. This isn’t just about the press. If you’ve been here you should know that.
DeleteSomerby does not use logic - although it’s clear he wants you to think otherwise, his most common fallacy is that he ignores context. He also leans into excessive literalism when he feels like it suits his point. He uses these logical and argumentative fallacies exclusively when attacking liberals.
DeletePointedly he is perfectly fine delving into context and nuance when it comes to defending those on the Right.
He also routinely attacks liberals and members of the blue tribe, blaming them for many, if not all, societal ills.
He will stipulate only to the most obvious and unavoidable negative traits of those on the Right, as long as they are relatively benign and unoffensive to the Right. (They’re generally fine with being called crazy, but get very triggered when called out on their racism, and worse, on their abusive behavior towards children) Somerby snickeringly employs this as a coy way of achieving plausible deniability, and a way of mocking liberals for being suckers - although the only ones that fall for it are his right wing fanboys.
Somerby started his blog by echoing other voices like Al Franken, Gene Lyons, and Dean Baker, attacking the press for not covering the corruption of the Right. He gained his audience and influence through this stance, but then shifted to the Right. This is why his critics are on the Left and his fans are on the Right.
Hector,
DeleteThere is a difference between liberals and the liberal media. Probably the biggest difference is that liberals exist.
The Right hates when you call them racists, because they hate that we are on to them.
DeleteAnd yet there are all those quotes I provided in my post at 7:08.
DeleteTo be on the right, in today's politics, has to mean that you'resomewhat supportive of Trump. So how does the thesis that Bob is on the right square with those quotes?
And yet Hector, you ignore context, or pretend to. You don’t give a fuck about logic, you’re just a run of the mill right winger defending your little hero.
DeleteAnd yet there are all those quotes I provided in my post at 7:08.
DeleteTrump uses his statements instrumentally, to boost his ego and to get what he wants from other people. He doesn't care what he says beyond that, and would laugh at someone who thinks truth is important, much as he has mocked Mike Pence for showing integrity and insisting on fulfilling his oath of office.
ReplyDeleteNotice how Trump recently promised free food to people in two different shops, then walked out without paying the bill.
DeleteThis is the same thing he did to Stormy Daniels, where he promised to consider her for his Apprentice show in exchange for sex, then walked away as if he had never made such an exchange.
Dishonest is dishonest in all contexts.
Studies show that non Fox News viewers are generally more informed than Fox News viewers, and that Fox News viewers who switch to CNN for a month will switch their views on certain subjects.
ReplyDeleteThis is in part due to the fact that Fox News viewers tend to be right wingers, who, definitionally, do not operate under any ideology but are merely people obsessed with dominance.
There is reasonable criticism of CNN and MSNBC, as they toe the line of corporate neoliberalism, but Somerby’s bitterness at his life’s circumstances blinds his ability to reason.
Trump has done the country a favor by illustrating how unjust our justice system is, how billionaires (even pretend ones) get special treatment compared to everyday people who commit crimes.
ReplyDeleteSomerby thinks we were fooled when our hopes were raised by Mueller's appointment to investigate Trump. We hoped that justice might be fairly apportioned by someone like Mueller. Unfortunately, the system failed us and a right wing appointee who appeared to have ethics turned out to be susceptible to pressure just like any other Republican. That doesn't make it right.
Somerby thinks our beliefs and hopes are the problem, not the system's failure to implement even-handed justice. We shouldn't have believed Mueller might act appropriately, so we are the problem, says Somerby. No, we were not wrong to hope. Mueller and corrupt judges and a system that does not function correctly for rich and poor alike, that is the problem. It needs to be fixed. But the first step is to convict Trump of as many of his crimes as possible. That is necessary in order to show the American people that some vestigate of fairness remains.
So that is why we at least keep hoping Trump will go to jail. To the extent that MSNBC and CNN echo that hope, they are reflecting an important American concern for fair treatment under the law. That is not nothing and it isn't blood lust either. It is how we American people can exert a check on a government whose Republicans would like to ignore whatever crimes they commit. If the government cannot provide justice for right wing miscreants, it isn't functioning for anyone. At that point, we will have a much bigger problem on our hands than partisan division.
I would be concerned if the press were not calling for Trump to be prosecuted and put in jail.
DeleteMao is gone so no more shitposting of those views. What is the point of reading this dumb blog?
ReplyDeletenostalgia
DeleteHey Anon 5:04 think about Jared Kushner while working as Trumps mideast peace envoy collecting $1.5B form Qatar, UA Arab Emirates while in office; and another $2B from the Saudis when out; and compare that to Biden's son who was not a Government official collecting millions. Both are scumbags, but one is an epoch scumbag with a crooked FIL.
DeleteOnce a scumbagry is tied directly to their father and one is not.
DeleteIn defense of Bob here.
ReplyDeleteWhat Bob is usually asking at the end of every blog is :
why is the speaker talking about this and not that?
Is it maybe unwise to argue about petty things on cable, messed up on a human level? Bob's a human being for not liking constant drivel.
Further, it's a wide pivot device which he uses to create a narrative of the totalitarian narrowness of corporate gibberish.
That puts Bob at a disadvantage from an argumentative point of view because he's trying to cover so many topics that he can't necessarily end up with all of them covered thoroughly, falling prey to the same thing that the media are doing. This is why the reader should be on his side but not necessarily believe everything he says without a citation or full context.
The fact is , American TV would not make sense to cut to a soda commercial break after covering how poverty has destroyed America's medical, education and others foundation systems and institutions.
Sociologists can show that ideological perspective shifts much sooner than Bob's multimillionaires that he lampoons as "darlings". It can change that at $100,000aires. From that point of view contextualism, sort of falls away and you turn into an idealist or from the negative point of view a solipsist.
The philosopher Immanuel Kant said wisdom was social knowledge. Since poverty is a systemic issue it's true that a corporate and multi-millionaire business media perspectives are not going to understand it in an in-depth way. You get your funny dancing goose commercial. And in Bob's mind that's what they are doing with Trump.
Well, let’s go to MSNBC’s coverage of Trump. It’s hardly constant drivel. While the station had some of the too cute tics I certainly could do without. The commentary is mostly by people who, unlike Bob, actually have some knowledge about what they are talking about from a legal standpoint. Bob’s childish dismissal of the Trump story, like his dismissal of the Jan 6 Committee, is based on the fact that he has no counter arguments. Bob endlessly mocked Rachel Maddow’s use of the word “forgery” but now that’s just what the fake electors gang have been charged with.That’s one example of many.
DeleteOne side’s election coverage has NOT been charged with three quarters of a billion dollars for lying about the 2020 election results, one has. Bob has nothing to say about this.
One could go on. All day.
Think about the bags of cash that Hunter Biden was bringing in from Siam, Tunisia and wait for it ... Ukraine! It's not like first sons haven't cashed in on their sweet daddy's name in the past.
DeletePlease stop trolling here. You aren't welcome.
DeleteMaddow reported it jerk.
DeleteHunter Biden, as a private citizen, was hired and then paid by other companies and entities. Sacre bleu!
DeleteThere was no illegality or corruption, which contrasts with the Trump crime family.
It’s funny but also sad to see those that can’t come to terms with the truth.
He showed up in El Paso claiming to have invented the empanada..
DeleteHunter Biden is cashing in on his name, so I'm voting for...checks notes... RFK, Jr.
DeleteLOL.
There’s a small chance that Trump could go to prison.
ReplyDeleteThere’s also a looming near certainty.
Delete10:00,
DeleteSmaller than his teeny tiny hands?