BREAKING: As heard last night about Russkie collusion!

TUESDAY, MARCH 13, 2018

We have to take folk at their word:
Yesterday, the Republicans on the House Intelligence Committee brought that panel's investigation of Trump and the Russkies to a screeching halt.

Among other things, they said they've found no evidence of collusion between the Trump campaign and the Russkies. For the record, we don't know if any such collusion occurred.

Last night, Erin Burnett conducted a long interview with Rep. Tom Rooney (R-Fla), one of the Republican committee members. How assiduous was the committee's search for the truth? At one point, Rooney made the highlighted remarks in response to Burnett's perfectly sensible question:
BURNETT (3/12/18): OK. When you say no collusion, how are you so confident about that? There are so many reasons, right, to ask this question. Yes, you had a lot of time to look at it. However, Bob Mueller has not yet reached that conclusion.

ROONEY: Right.

BURNETT: Your Senate colleague, Richard Burr, the Republican leader of the Senate Intelligence Committee, has said they have not reached that conclusion tonight.

ROONEY: Right.

BURNETT: Why are you all so confident that you have, and you are doing so completely on a partisan line?

ROONEY: I think that we have to go with the facts and the evidence as we've seen down in the committee. And the over 60 witnesses that we've interviewed, the documents that we have reviewed, just asking them point blank to their face, "Was there any of the things that we're looking at, was there any collusion, coordination, conspiracy, any of those things? Over the last year," have we been able to find any evidence of that, and we haven't.

Now, I know some of my friends on the other side of aisle say that we can't just take people's testimony at their word—

BURNETT: Right.

ROONEY: —but I think, in this system, you have to assume that people are telling the truth. And if it comes out that they were lying, then there's consequences for that. But I think first—I'm just going to base on evidence and fact of what we asked all of our witnesses. But Mueller and the Senate, who knows, maybe they're finding things that we haven't seen. But we certainly have not seen that.
To watch this exchange, click here, move ahead to 4:15.

Rooney was courteous throughout. But in that exchange, he issued a remarkable statement about the way an investigation should work:

"In this system, you have to assume that people are telling the truth!"

Some Democrats think you should try to check the facts about the various things different people tell you. To Rooney, that's going too far.

Thus spake Rep. Rooney! They asked sixty people, "point blank," if they colluded with the Russkies. None of the sixty said they had! On that basis, case closed!

Burnett simply moved on at the point. We think she should have lingered.

Meanwhile, this is the point to which our political culture has devolved. There's no sign that the downward spiral has stopped, and a great deal of the downward spiral is occurring Over Here, on our own liberal side.

58 comments:

  1. As far as we know, nobody has found any evidence of Collusion between Russia and the Trump campaign.

    I think w should look at the default. For some reason, many on the left see collusion as the default. Until collusion is definitively disproved, they will hold onto belief in Collusion.

    But why? Why should Collusion be the default belief? As far as I can see, collusion is the default only because liberals keep telling each other that collusion is the default.

    I think a better approach is "innocent until proven guilty." In politics lots of charges are thrown around. We shouldn't believe them until there's proof.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Oh I don't know: dirt on Hillary..I love it! Meeting with Russians in Trump Tower. Smells like collusion to me.

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    2. David in Cal - I'm a liberal, and I don't look at collusion as the default. I think that it's important not to get ahead of ourselves by jumping to conclusions that might be disproven, so I've been fine with waiting to see what happens, and that's where I remain today.

      But to say that nobody has found "any evidence" of collusion between Russia and the Trump campaign is just wrong. Just off the top of my head (and without researching these items for completeness):

      1. Donald Jr. took a meeting from a Russian who wrote him that she had negative information about Clinton, and that the Russian government wanted to help Trump win.
      2. Papadopoulos, while working for the campaign, said that Russia had e-mails that would be leaked to hurt the Clinton campaign.
      3. Roger Stone had interactions with Wikileaks at critical periods during the campaign, and it's my understanding that Wikileaks is suspected of being supported by the Russians.
      4. Trump himself said some things during the campaign that were timed suspiciously with respect to certain e-mail leaks.
      5. Many people involved with Trump have lied about their interactions with Russians, for no apparent reason if their interactions were above-board.
      6. Trump himself, along with his supporters like Devin Nunes, has acted in a manner that suggests guilt. By that I mean that a "normal" President would have allowed the FBI investigation to play itself out, on the understanding that it was important to fully investigate the level of interference in the election and the degree to which, if at all, that interference included people in the Trump campaign. But instead Trump has fought the intelligence community every step of the way, fired Comey, and tried to delegitimize Mueller. It's certainly possible that he's not guilty, but he's acting like he is.

      And that doesn't even touch on the strange fact that Trump seems unwilling to say a bad word about Russia, including saying that Americans are "killers, too," and refusing to jump to conclusions about Russia's actions where he acts impulsively in every other situation.

      Again, he might not be guilty, but it's just not accurate to say that there's no "evidence" of collusion. Maybe we don't yet have "proof," but we certainly have evidence.

      Delete
    3. David, can you spell: Seychelles

      How about Kushner attempting to set up a secret back channel with Moscow. In the fucking Russian Embassy? You ok with that, you treasonous bastard?

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    4. mm -- Seychelles is a big joke, for at least 3 reasons:

      1. the allegation was supposed supposed to be collaboration during the campaign. The trip to the Seychelles took place after the campaign was over and Trump was elected.

      2. For an elected President, a back channel of communication is a good thing to have. Communication with the enemy was always considered desirable. E.g., recall the founding of the UN. Recall the Cold War Hotline. During the Cuban Missile Crisis, JFK used back channel communications with the Soviets to save the world from nuclear war!

      3. The person who went to the Seychelles says he had no contact with the Trump people and was not representing them.

      Delete
    5. "Communication with the enemy was always considered desirable. E.g., recall the founding of the UN." So the UN was a way to communicate with the Axis. Good to know.

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    6. Pick a fucking lane, Comrade DinC, you treasonous bastard. Either the meeting occurred and it was entirely proper or it didn't happen because Erik Prince has laughably denied it happened. You are becoming grotesque.

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    7. mm -- well done! You make a statement that's refuted 3 different ways and somehow make it seem that multiple refutations strengthen your statement.

      Anyhow, there was a meeting in the Seychelles, but the American at that meeting says he had nothing to do with Trump or his Administration.

      Prince said he went to Seychelles as a private businessman, not as an official or unofficial emissary of the Trump transition team.

      https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/mueller-gathers-evidence-that-2016-seychelles-meeting-was-effort-to-establish-back-channel-to-kremlin/2018/03/07/b6a5fb8c-224b-11e8-94da-ebf9d112159c_story.html?utm_term=.35f11819c883

      Delete
    8. Caesar - the UN was founded October 24, 1945, after WW2 ended and there was no longer any Axis. America's enemy at that time definitely was the Soviet Union.

      Delete
    9. What a shock - one liar believes another liar.

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    10. keep whistling past the graveyard, Comrade DinC.

      I wonder why this guy was picked up by the FBI getting off the plane at Dulles and is now cooperating with Mueller.


      The New York Times’s Mark Mazzetti, David Kirkpatrick, and Adam Goldman reported Tuesday night that George Nader — an adviser to the de facto leader of the United Arab Emirates — is cooperating with Mueller’s probe. In a sign of his importance to the investigation, Nader testified before a grand jury last week.

      That’s big because Nader helped organize, and attended, that curious Seychelles meeting on January 11, 2017, shortly before Trump’s inauguration. The meeting brought together Erik Prince, Trump donor and founder of the private security company Blackwater, with Kirill Dmitriev, who manages a Russian sovereign wealth fund and is thought to be close to Vladimir Putin.


      But Prince’s story is now beginning to crumble. Reporting by the Washington Post and the New York Times indicates that Mueller now has new evidence and a cooperating witness who is allegedly testifying the Seychelles meeting was preplanned to set up communications between the Trump team and Moscow.

      by the way you fucking treasonous bastard, that "American" you refer to was Erik Prince the brother of his Sec of ED.


      Delete
    11. mm - Even before Mueller was appointed as SP, we have seen breathless story after breathless story about how some bit of evidence or some new witness was about to get Trump impeached. So far, every single one fizzled. mm, I admire your infinite patience.

      BTW this meeting took place around Jan. 11 — nine days before Trump’s inauguration. So Erik Prince was NOT the brother of Trump's Sec of ED when the trip took place.

      Delete
    12. we have seen breathless story after breathless story about how some bit of evidence or some new witness was about to get Trump impeached. So far, every single one fizzled...

      Really, you lying sack of shit? Can you rattle off a couple examples just off the top of your treasonous head?

      I never said she was the Sec of ED at the time of the meeting, jackass. You made it sound like this guy was just some random "American" who happened to be on this remote island, when in *reality* (you wouldn't be familiar with that word)he was a major donor and sibling of a future cabinet member. So it is not like this is such an improbable connection.

      Delete
    13. Earlier I gave 3 reasons why this Seychelles story makes no sense. Here is another one, from an article in Table Magazine, whoever they are:

      According to the foundational text of the collusion narrative, the dossier allegedly written by former British spy Christopher Steele, the Kremlin had cultivated Trump himself for years. So what’s the purpose of a back channel, when Vladimir Putin already had a key to the front door of Mar-a-Lago?

      BTW I wish people who think the Seychelles meeting implicates Trump in scandal would enunciate their narrative explaining why they believe that meeting indicates a scandal.
      http://www.tabletmag.com/scroll/257335/robert-muellers-beltway-cover-up

      Delete
    14. LOL, reminds me of the story, where the cop goes to arrest a guy and the criminal starts by saying "it wasn't me, I don't even own a red sports car, and besides it was parked in my garage all night".

      Let me help you out, Comrade DinC, you treasonous bastard. A veteran combat-decorated Marine officer is looking into the matter and will let you know when he is done.

      Delete
    15. I think you're exactly right, mm. The content of the Seychelles "scandal" is simply that Mueller is looking into it.

      I like your analogy. Sometimes people, especially minorities, are arrested, even though no obvious crime has been committed. Perhaps a policeman is pissed off. Later he can figure out what crime to charge the arrestee with. That's the story of Seychelles. There's appears to be no crime or scandal there. So what? First, the liberal media shout that it's a scandal. Later, perhaps, someone will choose some excuse as to why it was a scandal.

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    16. Hey, Comrade DinC, you shit-stained treasonous bastard. The "liberal media" didn't arrest George Nader. That was the FBI and Robert Mueller.


      ***
      •Special counsel Robert Mueller has reportedly determined that a meeting in the Seychelles between associates of President Donald Trump and a Russian banker was meant to help establish a secret back-channel between Trump and Russia.

      •This stands in contrast to the testimony one of the meeting's participants gave Congress last year.

      •Another of the participants is reportedly cooperating with Mueller's probe.
      ***


      Delete
    17. One of the headlines of a story in the blog the stupid troll's cited @ 10:28 - "Robert Mueller's Beltway Coverup."

      And he's lecturing others about their "narratives."

      SAD!

      Delete
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  2. "Some Democrats think you should try to check the facts about the various things different people tell you. To Rooney, that's going too far."

    And yet, the problem is Over Here.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Unless Erin Burnett and CNN is a liberal person/entity, that makes no sense to me either.

      Delete
  3. "But in that exchange, he issued a remarkable statement about the way an investigation should work"

    Well, that was, after all, congressional investigation, Bob. This is how they are conducted, by asking questions and recording answers. Those who commit perjury risk going to jail. Surely it must have some value?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. It's a crime to lie under oath at a criminal trial. If all it took to establish innocence were a denial by an accused, every criminal defendant would take the stand and swear that he/she didn't do it. Case closed, right?

      Delete
    2. Because the investigation was run by Republicans, it therefore has almost no value.

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    3. Witnesses, not the defendant. Witnesses testify before congressional committees. This is how it's done. And what would you suggest?

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    4. It Does have value. They talked to 60+ people. That's something; more than enough to get a clue. And then they talked among themselves.

      If they thought there might be something there, they would've been jumping the ship now, distancing themselves from Donald the Spectacular. But that's not happening. QED.

      Delete
    5. Yes, QED, if you believe Nunes and the Republicans have an ounce of integrity. They're a bit too blinded by the glow of Donald the Spectacular.

      Delete
    6. Look at the figures

      60 people testified that as far as they know there was no collusion

      Zero people have testified that there was collusion.

      Why shouldn't we go with the 60 to nothing?

      Delete
    7. Mao, the defendant is a witness. Under our system, he may choose not to testify, but but he usually does testify.

      Under your system, what happens to a defendant who prefers not to testify?

      Delete
    8. David, it's amazing what a group of blind partisans won't find when they aren't looking for it.

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    9. Caesar - you're enunciating a principle. Fair enough. Witnesses might lie. People with knowledge might not testify. But, can you get down to specifics?

      -- Which of these 60 witnesses do you think lied?

      -- On what basis do you judge that they lied?

      -- Which people who did not appear before this Committee would have testified to illegal Collaboration?

      -- What specific acts of collaboration would they have testified to?

      Caesar - I don't think you or anyone else can answer these questions.

      Delete
    10. That includes you, troll. Yet you conclude Nunes' bogus committee's conclusion is conclusive like the good little .0001%-bootlicker you are.

      Delete
    11. DavidinCal,
      Don't let people tell you you are too smart to fall for the lies of grifters. They're just trying to flatter you.

      Delete
    12. David, buddy, I'm just explaining to Mao that the defendant is a witness. For your benefit, I'll elaborate. If the defendant is guilty, he's a witness because he saw what he did. If he's innocent, he's a witness because he saw what he was doing when someone else committed the crime, or he saw what he was doing when no crime was committed.

      I also informed Mao that in our country the defendant isn't required to testify. I asked him what happens to defendants in his country who don't testify, but he didn't answer.

      As to the sixty, I haven't read their testimony. Maybe there was collusion, but they didn't see it. Maybe they saw it and lied. Or maybe there was no collusion to see!

      I don't pretend to know what I don't know.

      Do you think Uncle Vova colluded in the poisoning of Sergei Skripal and his daughter Yulia? Mr Trump's ambassador to the UN, Nikki Haley, thinks so.

      Delete
    13. Ask Comrade DinC how many witnesses refused to answer questions on orders from the WH. Ask Comrade DinC how much he wants to bet president treason refuses to testify to the Mueller team and winds up pleading the 5th.

      Delete
  4. Waving away Treason while claiming liberals hate America. The gift of Conservative projection, just keeps on giving.

    ReplyDelete
  5. You should not only not take people's word but you should invent fantasies (which could possibly be true! Anything can be true!) involving your political opponents and foreign powers. Then bring in people to testify and if they say there is nothing to it, keep looking for evidence that your fantasy is true. It might be! Don't believe anyone who says it isn't!

    ReplyDelete
  6. Somerby, DinC, Mao.
    Three lying sacks of shit.
    Bend over. Trump is gonna take care of you.

    ReplyDelete
  7. Trump is a liar and a thief.

    ReplyDelete
  8. Trump is a liar and a thief.

    ReplyDelete
  9. Trump is a liar and a thief.

    ReplyDelete
  10. Trump is a liar and a thief.

    ReplyDelete
  11. Trump is a liar and a thief,

    ReplyDelete
  12. Trump is a liar and a thief.

    ReplyDelete
  13. Trump is a liar and a thief.

    ReplyDelete
  14. BTW/ Trump us a liar and a thief.

    ReplyDelete
  15. Trump is a liar and a thief.

    ReplyDelete
  16. You gutless worms.
    Trump is a liar and a thief.

    ReplyDelete
  17. Trump is a liar and a thief.

    ReplyDelete
  18. Bob, Mao, DinC,
    Lying sacks of shit.
    Trump is a liar and a thief.

    ReplyDelete
  19. Trump is a liar and a thief.

    ReplyDelete
  20. Oh dear. Looks like the "liar and a thief" bot needs maintenance. Perhaps even decommissioning. Sad.

    ReplyDelete
  21. that certainly is a remarkable statement indeed. following that logic we would have to let every prisoner in the country out since they all say they didn't do it. I am not saying there was collusion, because Mueller is the only one holding all the cards on that question and he's not done, but to say there is no collusion because the guys you suspect of collusion say there is none??

    ReplyDelete
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